custom steering Knuckles and getting max lock

[Robo86]

I feel we need out own place to talk smack about steering knuckles. :P

Ok, i bent a power steering arm last week, and since i have to replace it i thought i might try something new.

There are a fair few different ones floating around now:
Techno Toy Tuning (T3):
http://www.ae86drivingclub.com.au/dcimages/6/9/27701.jpg
Garage Clear V3:Vid http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XFea-roTwl8
http://www.ae86drivingclub.com.au/dcimages/6/9/27702.jpg
3Up: Expensive! but nice
http://www.ae86drivingclub.com.au/dcimages/6/9/27703.jpg
Hibino's (not sure on name sorry, but JESUS he has some lock):
http://www.ae86drivingclub.com.au/dcimages/6/9/27704.jpg
http://www.ae86drivingclub.com.au/dcimages/6/9/27705.jpg

"With perfect Ackermann, at any angle of steering, the centre point of all of the circles traced by all wheels will lie at a common point. Note that this may be difficult to arrange in practice with simple linkages, and designers are advised to draw or analyze their steering systems over the full range of steering angles."

Ive found it pretty hard to get feedback about the whole Ackermann thing, mainly because theres just about no one in Australia with modded knuckles in AE86s (hi ken :P).

The silvia guys have been playing a fair bit in Aus, with reports of "improved corner speed, front grip and an overall gain in "snappy-ness".

Theres also the safety/legality side of things, they are welded after all :P.

I already have bucket loads of lock (ps arms, extra lock rack ends and long tie rod ends to support) but i think if i go for a knuckle like the ones above, the inside wheel will hit the castor rod? (i have about 2mm clearance on lock now). I know the solution is less wheel offset/ spacers but its not do-able for me atm (5-0 fail).

i wanna type more, but i cant think of what atm/ in a rush. will add later!

Lets have a discussion....... GO!
HIBINO!!!!!
http://www.ae86drivingclub.com.au/dcimages/6/9/27706.jpg
Robo.

[shift_rook]

yeah a bloke round my way modifies knucles to improve the ackermann, i've heard good feedback, don't run em personally but if mine fuck up it's what's next

[driftke70]

ill probably machine some up if i can be bothered otherwise just get something stupid like hibinos

[Matt-AE86]

Recently got Garage Clear Vol.3. In car and steering around the street at slow speed and did some crazy turns and such. Obviously made my steering heavier but It felt ALOT heavier.

Need to try it at speed/when sliding.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XFea-roTwl8

[--Redwork--]

Did you try those knuckles I did for you.???

[ae86]

what about pics of hey-man knuckles, see alot of cut and shuts on yaj

[Robo86]

Did you try those knuckles I did for you.???

holy moolllly. i completey forgot! going to install tonight :)

[Nic19]

i have custom 86 knuckles in my ae71. they have ackerman correction for drifting and are slightly shorter than PS arms. i dont have any rack spacers though... yet
i havnt had a good skid session with them but seem to hold big angles and feel a big heavy at low speeds but that doesnt concern me. i will give better feed back once i get a proper drift session in.

[Touge Boy]

I modded my knuckles in my R31/HR31... pretty crazy angle for a 31. Also had ikeya formula rack spacers in there too.

http://www.ae86drivingclub.com.au/dcimages/1/8/9/9/27711.jpg

I did have P/S arms with a AJPS lock spacer in the 86, but have since removed them for a new setup...

http://www.ae86drivingclub.com.au/dcimages/1/8/9/9/22789.jpg

I was simply going to replace them with the T3 setup, but I think after looking at hibino's car on lock... i wanna make my own el-retardo hyper-mega-super-lock knuckles and tub the front end at the same time :D

[Robo86]

http://www.ae86drivingclub.com.au/dcimages/6/9/547832.jpg
P.s Arm VS Redworks modified Arm, Ackermann change but same length as ps arm (as i requested)

[Konakid]

Club Outrun dudes have a JIG for AE86 PS arms, cut and shut a bit shorter with 5 degree ackerman, ive heard 0 ackerman is no good.

I honestly cant see the need for any more lock than PS arms and a lock spacer if you have to.

[Nic19]

its actually a guy called Jake from JDI fabrication with the jig, he did pidwells on his stock ke, leigh said he could pretty well get backward entries. i also have the ae86 ones done in the front of my ae71.

[Delazy]

http://photos-a.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc3/hs090.snc3/15734_198266443221_675663221_4001900_3955454_n.jpg

hey man knuckles...will be available for purchase for between $250 and $300 in coming weeks... being copied by nigel petrie of NP wonderknuckles fame :) few ppl already down for a pair...

hibino knuckles are basically unobtainable...the black ones he runs are only sold to sponsored drivers of the company that makes them, while the red ones are a mirror copy of ps knuckles...already tried to purchase them myself....

[benzo]

Is it just me or does the welding on those Garage Clear knuckles look dodge

Wouldn't Hibino's be 'Sunrise' seeing as its his shop..

I would be keen on a pair of NP Wonder 'Hey Man' copy knuckles when they're ready

[Matt-AE86]

Is it just me or does the welding on those Garage Clear knuckles look dodge

I guess the welds look shit but I reckon the penetration would be good. I'll let you know after I've done a few jumps and shit :P

The top one in that picture looks shit, i agree. Mine are more like the bottom one.


http://www.ae86drivingclub.com.au/dcimages/7/1/27224.jpg

http://www.ae86drivingclub.com.au/dcimages/7/1/27321.jpg

[Delazy]

Club Outrun dudes have a JIG for AE86 PS arms, cut and shut a bit shorter with 5 degree ackerman, ive heard 0 ackerman is no good.

I honestly cant see the need for any more lock than PS arms and a lock spacer if you have to.

you of all ppl should be of the knowledge level to know its not all about the lock characteristics of modified knuckles...

i own some "heyman" knuckles...am yet to drive on them and prolly wont for some time unless i put a pair in the ksev...

but feedback from ken was that the knuckles changed the amount of lock by absolutely fuck all...but the change in the way it drove was mad...

[boost+k]

the worse looking welds are often the strongest :))

are any of you that run really short arms moving your racks forward so you still have some mechcanial advantage and don't do the out of control flap at full lock?

because on my ke70 with power steering arms and 4mm spacers each side at full lock i have no control over my wheels because the steering arm is straight with the steering rack, it took me a while to figure this out because when at full lock i get no rubbing but after some track work i have polished bit of my chassis rail from rubbing (when the wheel is flapping at full lock)

[Robo86]

You can notice the ackermann change in the pic of the front matt! looks nice. hurry up and slide it!

[bigm]

for reference

Power Steering Arms have a spacing (from balljoint to tie rod hole) of 115mm

The updated T3 arms with 2 holes are: outer hole 115mm (same as power steer) and inner hole is 90mm. Super short.

Not sure about the ackerman angle tho.. is that just the difference between the mounting surface and the tie rod mounting surface?

[Matt-AE86]

You can notice the ackermann change in the pic of the front matt! looks nice. hurry up and slide it!

Yer I know hey, when I did that and took the picture I was like. "Cool, both pretty much same angle"

Also note, I am still running a KE70 steering rack, lol.

[Matt-AE86]

Not sure about the ackerman angle tho.. is that just the difference between the mounting surface and the tie rod mounting surface?

Yes, See how a standard arm has like that bend in it, and where the tie rod is mounted is offset to the ball joint hole.

When you are full lock, say.. doing a right hand corner, you are full lock to hte left. The outside wheel, which would be the passenger side will have most lock and hte inside wheel will not have as much. It will actually be dragging. So removing some of all of it, increases the inside wheel's lock.

Speaking to a good friend in japan he recommends just removing ackerman from p/s arms and the extra lock you get on the inside wheel is enough :)

[bigm]

im running T3 arms in my car. they are so short that the tie rod hits the LCA on the closest setting (90mm from balljoint)

I put it onto power steering hole (115mm) and it gives me more clearance to the tierod/LCA but the steering arm is very very close to level with the rack arm...

i duno how to go about moving the rack forward?

how did u overcome it on your car Boost+k?

and it is called binding when your steering arm and rack arm are at the same angle yea? you cant move at all?

This is a pic with it on the inner most setting.
http://www.ae86drivingclub.com.au/dcimages/1/7/2/27806.jpg
http://www.ae86drivingclub.com.au/dcimages/1/7/2/27807.jpg

[bigm]

yea thanks mate, i just wasn't sure where the measurements were taken from. ill measure my ones when i have them off next.

[--Redwork--]

Binding is when the ball joint the tie rod and the knuckle in the rack end are all inline..

The pic of yours Bigm is not binding...
Everyone on NS complains about binding with shortend knuckles in there s13's..

My s13 knuckles are shortend and i don't have any issues with it binding up.. And s13 into 86 is sposed to be worse than in S13..???


I've been waiting AGES for you to tell me how those knuckles went in your car Robo..
Can't believe you forgot about them... :(

I feel so neglected..

[Robo86]

hahaha, been busy man. put urs in but havnt put coils back in yet. The angle isnt 100% where the tie rod end bolts in. kinda doesnt wanna fit, but ill see!

[Nic19]

the JDI fabrication arms are, 10mm shorter than PS arms and 7mm off 0 ackerman.
robo i will still get a pic over the weekend sometime

[--Redwork--]

I was wondering if that might be a problem Rob...

I made them flat without the twist that the factory puts in them.. Its much easier to make the jig if you do them like that.. Plus they're only a prototype.. No biggy if they're quite right..
I noticed that a few of the aftermarket machined arms are flat so I figured it would still be alright..

[NIZLAH]

Cant coment too much on this but Ive just replaced my standard knuckles with the T3 items due to one being bent... I'm not/wasn't really looking for an increase in lock, just a stronger alternative.
The T3 knuckles are fuckin beefy as, solid steel around 15+ mm thick. I have them on the outer setting and my 15x8's 0 offset rims (195/50s) touch the inner guard wall on full lock, the other issue Ive encounted is on full lock the bottom of the arm hits (slightly) the top of the stock castor arm where it mounts to the LCA, but I think this is due to having xt130 arms....

This could probably be easily fixed by grinding a small amount from that area on the arm......

Haven't driven it yet apart from a lap down the street at no more than 15kms so cant really provide much more feedback other than the steering was pretty heavy but very direct (I have a quaife rack also)

[Matt-AE86]

There shouldn't be a problem fitting them unless the tie rod hole ID has changed. Just move the tie rod end bit around to fit in. My Garage Clear ones are flat.

[Delazy]

hey man products still retain the twist

[Robo86]

yer na itl work, i just wasnt sure. :)

only problem with the T3 ones (IMO) are that they are almost too strong, i kind of still want my knuckles to be one of the weakest links (in terms of what will bend / brake first).

[Matt-AE86]

yer na itl work, i just wasnt sure. :)

only problem with the T3 ones (IMO) are that they are almost too strong, i kind of still want my knuckles to be one of the weakest links (in terms of what will bend / brake first).

Really ?

I think its cheaper to replace a rack or tie rod end..

[Matt-AE86]

hey man products still retain the twist


http://www.homesick.com.au/shopping/prodpix%5Cfood%5Ctwisties.jpg

[Dom86]

im running T3 arms in my car. they are so short that the tie rod hits the LCA on the closest setting (90mm from balljoint)

I put it onto power steering hole (115mm) and it gives me more clearance to the tierod/LCA but the steering arm is very very close to level with the rack arm...

i duno how to go about moving the rack forward?



I'm having similar issues with my set up. The castor arm bolt hits the power steering arm. I'm also using a lock spacer.

http://www.ae86drivingclub.com.au/dcimages/1/4/3/27877.jpg (http://img44.imageshack.us/i/closeupsteerob9.jpg/)http://www.ae86drivingclub.com.au/dcimages/1/4/3/27878.jpg (http://img39.imageshack.us/i/lock3ft5.jpg/)

[boost+k]

im running T3 arms in my car. they are so short that the tie rod hits the LCA on the closest setting (90mm from balljoint)

I put it onto power steering hole (115mm) and it gives me more clearance to the tierod/LCA but the steering arm is very very close to level with the rack arm...

i duno how to go about moving the rack forward?

how did u overcome it on your car Boost+k?

and it is called binding when your steering arm and rack arm are at the same angle yea? you cant move at all?

This is a pic with it on the inner most setting.



i've just been living with it up till now,
but just fitted a new setup... i've had more teeth machined into my quick rack, put a big spacer on there and gone back to manual steering arms, also moved rack forward by removing rack mounts then notching crossmember forward and rewelding the mounts back out, alot of messing around and double measuring, got check you have clearance, and also angle it a little bit back to make sure you get enough grip on the steering shaft
havent tryed it at the track yet but testing so far seems mint, alot lighter and smoother, next i will redo arms for less acker angle and inbetween p/s and non length, but not enough hours in the day...

90mm is abit crazy imo, more of a option for a p/s rack.... you have stuff all control when your ball joing is that close to the lower arm, try doing a tight 180 with abit of speed and you'll probally get steering lock out

(on 115 setting) when you drop your car onto the ground move it to full lock and then go and grab the inside wheel and try and twist it for more lock and it will probally move because it can flap around at this point because the arms are straight


btw you need some twist/angle in the arms or they will bind and wear out ball joints fairly quickly

[sundee]

Those garage clear arms look like rubbish - the 3up arms are a neat job but still have been cut and welded - Hibino's items, assuming garage sunrise look super hott, but i could imagine you would pay for them...
no bias here but the T3 arms are definatly the best for design:cost...
their safe, ie no dirty cut n weld jobs, all cnc machined and plated.
beefed up for extra strength
can do them for:
$185 + delivery ;)

[Dom86]

boost+K = interesting work, got any pic's of what you've done?

[Delazy]

Hibino's items, assuming garage sunrise look super hott, but i could imagine you would pay for them...


they arent made by garage sunrise...hinbino runs them as he is sponsored by the company that makes them...they also arent available to the general public...only for sponsored drivers...ive tried to get my hands on them myself and had little luck

[sundee]

they arent made by garage sunrise...hinbino runs them as he is sponsored by the company that makes them...they also arent available to the general public...only for sponsored drivers...ive tried to get my hands on them myself and had little luck

I see... well that rules them out....

[Konakid]

No. You generally break more than that.

Dunno why t3 over engineer their stuff sooo much. So heavy and jeopardises the chassis!

Ill take some pics of the shortened corona knuckles ill be trying soon

Not for gripping tho

Its like 'Supersize me' for modified car parts.

Looks good, but ultimately fails.

[sundee]

each to their own.

[Intense]

Guys, I've just got a stock adm rack with aussie steering arms, running 195/50/15's on 8" rims and on full lock my wheels already grind away at the inside of the guard, so much so that it looks like polished metal. So if I got p/s arms wouldn't that make the problem even worse? How do you all run so much lock without this problem, the only way I can think to fix this is to run spacers on the front or increase the front track with lower offset rims.

[sundee]

Getting PS arms will just give u more lock, so it will just jam the wheel into the inner guard even harder

What offset are the wheels?
increasing the track , with wheel offset or longer LCA's is your answer, or a slip on spacer for quick fix . dont quote me on this but i thin for 8's up front u need atleast a Zero offset to get clearance.

[Intense]

I've got 8" front with -4 offset. Going to get bolt on guards and +25mm bolt on spacers all round so that should solve the problem

[corknose]

i think even my 14x8 -12 still rub

[boost+k]

dom86 : heres a pic but i dont have a referance pic of a factory one to compare to
http://img233.imageshack.us/img233/8983/crossmembermod.jpg

intense :you need longer lower arms for big lock potential... i run 195-45's at the track for more clearance also, you should get away with ke30 lower arms with manual steer arms, there about 10mm longer, are you running camber plates aswell?

[Intense]

Yeah already got camber plates maxed out, cusco ones that only max out at -1.5 degrees. Planning to go bc coilovers later on so I should be able to get more camber out of those. If I were to go a different set of lca's I'd probably use corona ones because they're easy to come by.

[corknose]

youll want to set it max posative to stop rubbing if u think about it, its pulling in closer at the top.

[ae86hachiroku]

Just cause the Garage clear arms have lumpy welds doesn't mean their any dodgier than any other cut/shut arms. If it's welded, it's welded, if you get paranoid grind it smooth.

Been running Hey-man arms for awhile now. Cut and shut arms lock aren't any greater than powersteering arms, the difference is of course ackerman, since both wheels are pointed towards the way your steering instead of one giving more drag, therefore, whilst sliding you will feel less front scrub and actually be able to carry more speed through your entries and mid slides. The difference in lock is that you'll get to max lock faster and have quicker steering.

Someone mentioned about how you stop scrubbing on your wheel walls and how you would get anymore lock. You need more castor and more track, then it won't scrape.

For track use, shortened and 0 ackerman knuckles are great, even for street it's awesome, but you can definitely live without it. Work on other aspects of suspension/chassis before this, it's one of those things where, unless your getting real technical and your car can match your driving skill, you won't really notice it. Example, if your still arse dragging and doing weak entries, it's just silly.

[boost+k]

Yeah already got camber plates maxed out, cusco ones that only max out at -1.5 degrees. Planning to go bc coilovers later on so I should be able to get more camber out of those. If I were to go a different set of lca's I'd probably use corona ones because they're easy to come by.

Intense : your camber plates won't be helping... better to go for longer lower arms and set the camber plates further out to get clearance

IMO camber plates are not for gaining camber they are only there for tuning the setup/ getting even settings, i always run longer arms to gain the camber i want...

just remember that any track you gain in the front you should also add to the rear to keep things balanced

yea corona/ke30 arms same thing so all good :sunnies:

what ae86hachiroku said is dead right, drive your setup to its limits then start doing things like this to get faster/smoother

[sundee]

Just cause the Garage clear arms have lumpy welds doesn't mean their any dodgier than any other cut/shut arms. If it's welded, it's welded, if you get paranoid grind it smooth.

Ahh That statement is false. just because its welded doesnt meant its going to hang together at all.. and if they have put an effort in like that it doesnt show skill or workman ship, it shows a hack.
The weld needs to penitrate the metal properly to create the right fusion.
its not just a matter of slapping on some weld, because the weld WILL just break..

[Konakid]

Intense: Run XT130 LCA's and you'll have no problems with PS arms.

[ae86hachiroku]

Ahh That statement is false. just because its welded doesnt meant its going to hang together at all.. and if they have put an effort in like that it doesnt show skill or workman ship, it shows a hack.
The weld needs to penitrate the metal properly to create the right fusion.
its not just a matter of slapping on some weld, because the weld WILL just break..

I'd imagine they would have done it properly before thinking about selling to mass amount of buyers over yahoo auction. Their ugly welds, but seeing it in person it looks solid enough, how can I tell for sure though but that's the way it seems.

[sundee]

3up arms are welded once... the garage clear ones, have been welded a few times.. y?
because the 1st weld wasnt satisfactory.

the 3up arm have been cleaned up but u can see the area that has been cleaned up.. and its isolated to the area of the join itself....

no point arguing, i just know IMO i would never put something like that im my car..
but each to their own.

[Dom86]

....and you shouldn't really grind welds because that weakens the weld. I have a boilermaker friend that pointed that out to me.
But I'm with Ken about them being mass produced and and safe as any other.

Cheers Boost.

[fantapants]

if you wanna know if its a safe weld xray it or cut it in half :)

[Touge Boy]

I wasnt going to get involed in the whole welding debate... but since Im here.

Straight away.... there's a chance it can crack.... simply cause it's cast metal which has been heat cycled.. No if's or buts. Heat turns cast brittle. This is fact.

BUT, if the cast has been pre-heated properly before, and proper weld preps done, the chance is a lot less likely. So unlikely that if you were to hit something, the cast itself would bend/break before the weld would.

The garage clear arms would be fine.... if they have been prepped properly. They dont look like they have been welded twice either... more like 2 or 3 massive high heat/high feed fillets

Ive made my own knuckles.... S13 to be precise, and they had 18 x 11's on them, and pushed to an inch of their life. Gutter hits and all. No cracking at all. only bent one. And it's cracked.... because I was lazy and stupid and I heated it with an oxy and bent it back out again.

90% of most "extra-lock" knuckles are cut and shut. Only a select few arent.... GP SPorts comes to mind. But then again, you pay the premium for them.

As fantapants said... X-Raying is really the only PROPER way of knowing, magnetic particle testing would work too, but I think it's a bit overkill in this case.


In short.... I would happily use cut and shut knuckles..... if I had done them myself. But if the proper prep and work have been carried out, they'll be fine. If you still dont want to use them... then dont. End debate.

[--Redwork--]

Touge Boy.. they're FORGED.. not CAST.. But same rules apply... Good preheat and 100% weld penitration and you laughing..

X ray is the best... Mag particle only shows defaults at the surface of the weld and can miss quite abit..

Your got your knuckles in yet Robo.??
Any feed back.

[Delazy]

90% of most "extra-lock" knuckles are cut and shut. Only a select few arent.... GP SPorts comes to mind. But then again, you pay the premium for them.

and more ppl had trouble with them than they did with cut and shuts...

basically the reason they are no longer availabe is that too many ppl were snapping them...

pickering killed his with a minor tap, while josh coote also bent his from quite a minor love tap...

meanwhile ppl with cut and shuts go bouncing off rippled strips into walls and they survive to skid another day....

[Touge Boy]

Touge Boy.. they're FORGED.. not CAST.. But same rules apply... Good preheat and 100% weld penitration and you laughing..

X ray is the best... Mag particle only shows defaults at the surface of the weld and can miss quite abit..

Your got your knuckles in yet Robo.??
Any feed back.

I assume you're talking about AE86 arms? Cause I know a lot of nissan stuff is Die-Cast. But either way, as you said... same rules apply. And yeah, X-Ray is the best, mag particle was just another example, but all were beside the point...

If they've been well though out, prepared properly and welded well then there shouldnt be an issue.


and more ppl had trouble with them than they did with cut and shuts...

basically the reason they are no longer availabe is that too many ppl were snapping them...

pickering killed his with a minor tap, while josh coote also bent his from quite a minor love tap...

meanwhile ppl with cut and shuts go bouncing off rippled strips into walls and they survive to skid another day....

And it's quite strange isnt it... you'd "THINK" that a properly made aftermarket knuckle would take some punishment, given it's use. Weird.

[Dom86]

This is how my lock is stopped...:worried:
What am doing wrong?? Does everyone using a lock spacer and power steering knuckles have this issue?
How do I fix it and will aftermarket arms help?
http://www.ae86drivingclub.com.au/dcimages/1/4/3/28436.jpghttp://www.ae86drivingclub.com.au/dcimages/1/4/3/28437.jpg

[Konakid]

Thats the most lock you can get without cutting away and rewelded a cut-out section in your lca so the tire rod and steering arm can travel further.

You shouldnt need any more lock that that tho, have you driven it like that yet?

[Dom86]

No, the car is still being built. Take note that there is no motor or box in it yet, not sure how much difference that will make.
I'm not really trying to get more lock, because its pretty good.
I'm more concerned with the steering hooking up mid drift, and bits being damaged and failing.
http://www.ae86drivingclub.com.au/dcimages/1/4/3/28464.jpg (http://img32.imageshack.us/i/suss1z.jpg/)http://img511.imageshack.us/img511/9954/susse.th.jpg (http://img511.imageshack.us/i/susse.jpg/)

[corknose]

just got a pair of t3 today, fark they are heavy and over engineered!! do u think they would be strong enough if they were aluminium.

[sundee]

heavy? they only weigh 1kg... u could make them in alli but u would want some hi spec aircraft grade... atleast they wont bend and if u hit something no matter what u will bend a tie rod or rack end.. i dont see the big deal.. chuck em in.. put on shortest setting and enjoy the lock!

[boost+k]

This is how my lock is stopped...:worried:
What am doing wrong?? Does everyone using a lock spacer and power steering knuckles have this issue?
How do I fix it and will aftermarket arms help?
http://www.ae86drivingclub.com.au/dcimages/1/4/3/28436.jpghttp://www.ae86drivingclub.com.au/dcimages/1/4/3/28437.jpg

thats what i was talking about further back in the thread, when you run like that you will get steering lockout when do really tight turns

also not that when the car is on the ground the weight makes the angle change and you won't normally hit that lip bit, you'll hit the arm itself, mine has big dents/polished area from hitting with the old setup :DD

[ae86hachiroku]

No, the car is still being built. Take note that there is no motor or box in it yet, not sure how much difference that will make.
I'm not really trying to get more lock, because its pretty good.
I'm more concerned with the steering hooking up mid drift, and bits being damaged and failing.
http://www.ae86drivingclub.com.au/dcimages/1/4/3/28464.jpg (http://img32.imageshack.us/i/suss1z.jpg/)http://img511.imageshack.us/img511/9954/susse.th.jpg (http://img511.imageshack.us/i/susse.jpg/)

Dom you won't have any problem with binding or whatever. I've been like that for years, oddly enough when I'm actually driving and using the lock it doesn't scrape anymore. Probably some of my old pics around but there's definitely more lock on the entry than static.

[Dom86]

Ok, thanks for the feedback boost+ken:rolleyes:

boost, I'd be interested in more pics once it's all back in the car.

I was considering welding a slide onto the LCA for the rack knuckle to rub up against in an attempt to stop any possibility of it hooking up and as a 'loch stop'.
Any feed back on that idea?

[boost+k]

did i forget to mention that, i have also made some lock stoppers but not installed them yet, they are adjustable so depending on which offset rims i run on the front i can adjust so i always have clearance of the chassis rails

you won't notice it at speed, its only low speed (munji type stuff) with 180 degree's that i've noticed

[Dom86]

did i forget to mention that, i have also made some lock stoppers but not installed them yet, they are adjustable so depending on which offset rims i run on the front i can adjust so i always have clearance of the chassis rails

you won't notice it at speed, its only low speed (munji type stuff) with 180 degree's that i've noticed

LOL, that shouldn't be a problem for me then as Barbagallo needs a first corner munji entry speed of 140+.

I'd be interested in seeing your lock stopper too.

[Matt-AE86]

Dom I don't think you will have any problems but if you are really worried maybe put a small rubber insulation pad.

[Golberg]

Thats the most lock you can get without cutting away and rewelded a cut-out section in your lca so the tire rod and steering arm can travel further.

You shouldnt need any more lock that that tho, have you driven it like that yet?

There is another way!

RCA ball joints will solve the issue, as they put the steering arm up higher from the LCA

[sundee]

There is another way!

RCA ball joints will solve the issue, as they put the steering arm up higher from the LCA

yeah would prolly sort the problem, i have a few sets with knuckles if anyone is keen. great as they come with bump steer spacers and the spherical bearing has a lower profile then the stock outer tie rod

[Buck]

stop trying to flog your t3 junk at EVERY opportunity...

and it wouldnt solve the problem, it would merely change it...if anything, it will make it more likely that the tie-rod will form a straight line with your rack and render your car steeringless

take the tie-rod hitting your control arm as a "good thing", it stops the above from happening, ive had it happen and it can be very scary shit


yeah would prolly sort the problem, i have a few sets with knuckles if anyone is keen. great as they come with bump steer spacers and the spherical bearing has a lower profile then the stock outer tie rod

[Touge Boy]

i have a few sets with knuckles if anyone is keen. great as they come with bump steer spacers and the spherical bearing has a lower profile then the stock outer tie rod

How much you want for the T3 knuckles? I need some. toyota P/S knuckles or otherwise.

[Delazy]

stop trying to flog your t3 junk at EVERY opportunity...

werd...i duno how many times ive seen "buy t3 shit" posted over the last couple weeks...

[sundee]

stop trying to flog your t3 junk at EVERY opportunity...

and it wouldnt solve the problem, it would merely change it...if anything, it will make it more likely that the tie-rod will form a straight line with your rack and render your car steeringless

take the tie-rod hitting your control arm as a "good thing", it stops the above from happening, ive had it happen and it can be very scary shit


werd...i duno how many times ive seen "buy t3 shit" posted over the last couple weeks...

so if u dont like their stuff dont buy it! whats your problem?? as if it even affects you!... but if u read below some guys actually want the stuff, your not going to like everything you read.


How much you want for the T3 knuckles? I need some. toyota P/S knuckles or otherwise.

ill PM you man.

[Buck]

i have no intention of buying anything form the "over engineered chasis bender group"

i have no problem with you selling it, but i am sick of seeing post after post saying "buy t3" "ive got plenty in stock" etc etc, especially considering your not a sponsour, and the sheer number of people who have claimed to be T3 distributor and have clearly been just an agent, which is kind of pointless when they speak english anyway......if people want to buy the product then they can go into the Group Buy thread and post in there

just try and keep it out of every other thread

[Touge Boy]

i have no intention of buying anything form the "over engineered chasis bender group"


My chassis is already bent. If I hit it in the right spot, Im hoping I can bend it back.:yeah:

[Buck]

^^^hahaha, i think that coupe is alittle beyond saving :P

[boost+k]

There is another way!

RCA ball joints will solve the issue, as they put the steering arm up higher from the LCA


i've never seen "rca ball joints" for sale, where are they available? and like buck said it would make the problem worse for most of these guys setup's

[corknose]

I think they mean outer tie rods, but I'm probs wrong.

[Touge Boy]

^^^hahaha, i think that coupe is alittle beyond saving :P

Everything is adjustable up front now... so she'll be right.:hehe:


i've never seen "rca ball joints" for sale, where are they available? and like buck said it would make the problem worse for most of these guys setup's

You can buy them here in Aus from Driftshop... I had them in my 31's.... pity they're only like 10-15mm.


I think they mean outer tie rods, but I'm probs wrong.

No, you can buy balljoints with an in-built roll centre adjuster.. buy it's usually only 10-15mm.... I havent seen much bigger.

[sundee]

i have no intention of buying anything form the "over engineered chasis bender group"

i have no problem with you selling it, but i am sick of seeing post after post saying "buy t3" "ive got plenty in stock" etc etc, especially considering your not a sponsour, and the sheer number of people who have claimed to be T3 distributor and have clearly been just an agent, which is kind of pointless when they speak english anyway......if people want to buy the product then they can go into the Group Buy thread and post in there

just try and keep it out of every other thread

Slight exageration but point taken, "chasis bending" everyone has their opinion.

[Delazy]

nigel has completed the jig of my "Heyman products knuckles" so i imagine will be able to start doing copies for ppl as of next week...

anyone interested drop me a pm...

looking around the $200 mark and will need to provide standard knuckles...(normal or power steering)

should be quite abit stronger than any of the jap copies and get the added bonus of modified ackermans over the t3 equivalent

[Robo86]

what sorta dimensions are the heymans? much shorter than ps?

[Delazy]

what sorta dimensions are the heymans? much shorter than ps?

i didnt bother measuring them...but ken may have dimensions...otherwise ill have some this weekend when i get them back...

btw...anyone wanna buy genuine heyman knuckles? :thumbup:

[Robo86]

pending length i might buy some nigel ones. i dont have much room to play with though so they could only be like 5-10mm shorter than ps

[Delazy]

pending length i might buy some nigel ones. i dont have much room to play with though so they could only be like 5-10mm shorter than ps

i dnt even think they are all that much shorter anyways...nigel could definitely "modify" the design to suit...much like he has for everyone else with s13 ones...

[--Redwork--]

Robo...Did you give my knuckles a run .??

I'll be offended if you didn't.!!.

Been waiting months for your feed back on them...

[Robo86]

cars not runnig man, no fuel tank atm, but there in. so yer.

my rims foul on my castor rods though, so i dunno what im gunna do

[--Redwork--]

Whats wrong with that.?? You could redrill the castor rod holes futher in if posible.. Won't make a masive difference though, I would imagine..

And that was bound to happen any ways..
Less ankerman means your outside wheel is gunna pull as much angle as you inside one..

Get your car sorted man... I NEED FEED BACK...

I want to make some for my car but waiting to see if i should alter the design a bit first..

[Robo86]

the only proper cure is less wheel offset or spacers, neither of which i can do at the moment. the design looks fine.

seriously ive got more than enough on my plate atm, can barely even sort a fuel pump out, feel freee to try them in urs first if you want.

[--Redwork--]

Cars still getting built... :(
And I just plowd up the arse of a pergoet on the way home so now I have to fix my daily.. So even less time/money to spend on my toy..

I have two spare set of knuckles here.. Might make a pair the same as the ones I gave you and maybe a less corrected pair.. See how things go...

Its AMAZING that no ones here has actually comented on the way there car drives with altered knuckles... Sorta pointless thread if no ones gives input..

[Robo86]

ahh bummer dude.
yer well work is slowing down the end of this week, so hopefully i get my shit together this weekend.

[Touge Boy]

Whats with the fuel pump robo?

I reckon ive got a S5 RX7 pump around here you can have if you need one. Be plenty of fuel :cool:

[ae86hachiroku]

Cars still getting built... :(
And I just plowd up the arse of a pergoet on the way home so now I have to fix my daily.. So even less time/money to spend on my toy..

I have two spare set of knuckles here.. Might make a pair the same as the ones I gave you and maybe a less corrected pair.. See how things go...

Its AMAZING that no ones here has actually comented on the way there car drives with altered knuckles... Sorta pointless thread if no ones gives input..

Pretty sure I gave my opinion a few pages back....

[Matt-AE86]

Added quote if your eyes are broken Redneck.



Been running Hey-man arms for awhile now. Cut and shut arms lock aren't any greater than powersteering arms, the difference is of course ackerman, since both wheels are pointed towards the way your steering instead of one giving more drag, therefore, whilst sliding you will feel less front scrub and actually be able to carry more speed through your entries and mid slides. The difference in lock is that you'll get to max lock faster and have quicker steering.

[--Redwork--]

^^^^^ My comment was aimed at the fact this thread is now 5 pages long and there has only been limited imformation on how this mod actually effects the way the car handels and drives...

Matt.. your comment only indicates what altering the ankerman does at a mechanical level.. You don't say anything about the way car feels...

That is what I was getting at.

[keiichi]

didn't really read all the pages but...

0 ackermann means when drifting, the chasing wheel isn't dragging at lock. however, when you're driving around a roundabout, since your front wheels are traveling around a different radius (in much the same way we have open diffs), your outside wheels is going to be somewhat pushed around the corner... combined with your locked diff - FUN TIMES!!!

also when you weld cast steel, the point at which the heat disperses into the cold zone the cast will fracture. make sure the ones you get are heat treated ;)

[keiichi]

also adding to what ae86hachiroku said that you will be able to carry more speed since one of your wheels isnt dragging... since the front of your car is the pivot, you'll be less prone to spinning. think of it like putting one of your arms out in the water while surfing or whatever.

[Matt-AE86]

Matt.. your comment only indicates what altering the ankerman does at a mechanical level.. You don't say anything about the way car feels...

That is what I was getting at.

Its not my flippin comment already. Its Ken, and that's how it felt to him. He's driven it with modified knuckles countless times. To him, what it does, is how it feels.

[Dom86]

also adding to what ae86hachiroku said that you will be able to carry more speed since one of your wheels isnt dragging... since the front of your car is the pivot, you'll be less prone to spinning. think of it like putting one of your arms out in the water while surfing or whatever.

It's not the quantity of information, it's the quality of information.
I think most of what needed to be said, has been.
I have personally found this thread vary enlightening. Now I know what anchorman is. He's a pirate!
But seriously that bit in color of keiichi's quote is soooooo true if you have ever seen Ken in action. He pulls amazing angle with speed but rarely spins.

[--Redwork--]

I need to invest in a fire suit..

I need to add that I was only trying to get more information in this thread..
I already know the benifits of modded knuckles while drifting.

I would how ever like to know what their like during normal(ish) street driving..

I have sortened S13 knuckles in my car ATM.. lock to lock is 2.5 turns.
Which is something I dont think anyones touched on yet...

Shorter arms require less rack travel to achieve that same steering angle


Also driving with the car like this is awesome.. Bit strange at first cause its SO responsive to steering imputs, but once you get used ot it it just feels normal... Got back in my ute after driving my 86 for a couple of months and couldn't believe how terible the steering felt...
Felt like I was driving a truck I had to spin the wheel that much..

[Matt-AE86]

Yer, i did say that in my KE thread though its not in this thread or linked to it. It was awesome twitchy/responsive at speed, and wanted to dart, which is how i like my 86/ke's to be.

A little heavy when going out of the drive way, but on the road at 20-30km even then it wanted to dart left or right when you turned either way. felt great, got me excited :)

[keiichi]

toe-in can be a good compromise for after-market knuckles since the further you turn the closer to 0deg your toe becomes. yeh yeh you lose a bit of lock big whoop, +toe = stability aswell. i heard its not good to run toe in when you have lots of camber though. but i cant see why.
i know someone who used to swear by toe-in on his drifter.... and after some quality brain time i now know why. i seen this guy chuck manjis at 120kmph down the highway with an open diff aswell - that is stability!

[driftke70]

im a fan of toe in.

[ae86hachiroku]

im a fan of camel toe

[Konakid]

im a fan of toe in.

Really?

I love toe out, only 1mm overall tho to save the front tyres.

2mm overall car is super responsive.

[driftke70]

it has its ups, i like the feel of it on lock

[R&D Mechanical]

And does anyone take into consideration the point of no return?

[shift_rook]

i wasn't thinkin when i got a quick rack, now with ps arms i doubt i'll have much more than 2 turns in my 86, mah mah mah monsta forearms

[racsov]

if your stuff binds then adjustable steering stops would probabaly be a good idea

[R&D Mechanical]

This is my setup and i think it will be quite enough.

Power steering arms
Lock spacer
XT130 arms
15x8 -9 wheels
Adjustable tie rod ends


I am still having trouble with scubing but i think i can fix it when it gets wheel aligned, i wouldnt mind getting some adjustable control arms to bump the track out abit to get some good clearance.
http://photos-e.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc3/hs048.snc3/13555_317845400183_603015183_9643647_570752_n.jpg

[worked]

just found this mint thread, put the paddles to it's chest and fired it back into life
good bit of reading thats for sure
having our own test rig at work we've found generally on steel one inch of weld will take a ton of pressure before bending or breaking, not sure how cast will react but if you get that much pressure on a hit to your tie rod you've crashed pretty much, i can't see day to day driving or drifting affecting it at all, but stranger things have happened!
secondly do you need more lock?? power steering arms give heaps of lock, but the ackerman and dragging that wheel would be interesting to see how getting rid of it changes things
josh priseman said to me once 'don't fuck with the car ed, just drive it'. good advice i reckon, gets a bit old when your forever fucking about with your buses setup
that said i'd happily put ps arms with less ackerman in my bus if it made 360's easier to do =)

[Robo86]

totally forgot about this thread. its good!

for anyone who cares i think im gunna get some heyman copys from Nigel in the coming weeks. so hopefully have some feedback.

[Delazy]

for anyone who cares i think im gunna get some heyman copys from Nigel in the coming weeks.

thanks delazy ;) haha

i havent even got around to using the jig yet myself...however taking 2 pairs of stock knuckles across to drift attack next weekend to give him to do for me...

one pair going into the ksev straight up to see how they go...

[blair]

Whats the deal-io with getting the copies made up? i got a donor pair here... x

[shift_rook]

i can get the jdi cut and shuts if you'd like to send em down, pretty insane knuckles, not sure on pricing, times like this a regret that quick rack, my steering is so bullshit heavy and this is just with pwr steer arms, still got the cut'n'shuts i'm yet to put on, gonna be pretty sweet for sliding though

[stx-16]

Whats the deal-io with getting the copies made up? i got a donor pair here... x

2nd^^^

[R&D Mechanical]

i should update my setup on here again, Im not sure what knuckles ajps gave me but they do a great job!

[shift_rook]

they're the jdi ones...

[Hachi_Tom]

I know its probably nothing but i was wondering if you guys can tell what has been done (like lock spacers slip on or bolt on or any other way of increasing lock) to myn just by a photo at full lock, i havent had a look under my car since ive brought it and the guy didnt say anything about increasing the lock..
sorry for nooby post but im a nooby.
cheers, Tom

full lock.

http://www.ae86drivingclub.com.au/dcimages/4/2/5/9/46215.jpg

[keiichi]

looks like stock from here, nice tires but get rid of the kit eh

[bigm]

Tom,
bring it around one night or to dinner next week and ill have a look.

To check if it has lock spacers. Jack the car up and count the amount of turns lock to lock. If it has an ajps Lock spacer it will be 3.7 turns, if it is standard it will have 3.2ish? i think.

also ill measure the steering arms when i have a look..

Regardless make our lock spacers :P :)

[bigm]

Has anyone has issues with the Tie rod end fouling on the Lower Control arm? This happens to me before my lock runs out.

[Just Half Steppin]

i have had that problem before, but i like it...i see it as my saving point, as the rack cant get in a direct line and lockout...

i did have one setup with the tierod hitting the swaybar link before running out of lock...was abit dicey at full lock though, got to be a bit hard to turn back at times....

[Delazy]

http://livedoor.2.blogimg.jp/deep_blue_go50/imgs/8/4/84d79561.jpg
http://livedoor.2.blogimg.jp/deep_blue_go50/imgs/e/9/e9393a37.jpg

pics i found on the "looking" blog :)

[Sprinter86]

If Any one is after the JDI knuckles send me a pm, as i can arrange it.

He does changeover AE86/XT130 and KE70 knuckles. They have been X-Rayed by a company that does weld testing for would-be engineers, and they say they are exceptional quality and strength.

Ive run both the corolla and xt130 ones, awesome results.

[FAST EDDIE]

ive weled my own cast knuckles (s13) and have a jig for them coppied from my jap ones i bought, didnt realy know what i was doing but they are fine have used them a fair few times, even the dogee looking ones seem to be fine so dont know why people stress about shit looking welding on cast knuckles. wouldnt use them on the street tho!!!!

[blair]

ive weled my own cast knuckles (s13) and have a jig for them coppied from my jap ones i bought, didnt realy know what i was doing but they are fine have used them a fair few times, even the dogee looking ones seem to be fine so dont know why people stress about shit looking welding on cast knuckles. wouldnt use them on the street tho!!!!

You answered your own question bro!

[keiichi]

You answered your own question bro!

i think he means because of what it does to your steering.

[FAST EDDIE]

i meen im seeing alot of responses on here saying the welding looks questionable and so on and just wanted to let people know

[JinxD]

If Any one is after the JDI knuckles send me a pm, as i can arrange it.

He does changeover AE86/XT130 and KE70 knuckles. They have been X-Rayed by a company that does weld testing for would-be engineers, and they say they are exceptional quality and strength.

Ive run both the corolla and xt130 ones, awesome results.
Any idea on cost (86) i want some more lock on my rig

[Delazy]

Heres a quick run down on the benifits of doing this modification as found on http://ets-products.blogspot.com/




• Decreasing ackerman angle gives the biggest adavantage to a drift car. What this does is the less ackerman you run the straighter the front wheels will be in relation to each other. In a normal Knuckle setup the front wheels on full lock are toeing out by massive amounts, by changing the mounting point on the knuckle we decrease the toe out and it brings the mid corner speed, front end grip and rear end drive up a lot.

• Increasing lock is what everyone in the drift world wants to do, the more lock you have the less chance you have of spinning. By shifting the mounting point of the tie rod end to the knuckle out further to decrease ackerman you are instantly increasing lock as the knuckle rotates further around before it hits the lock stop.

• Decreasing bump steer at the same time as decreasing your ackerman is a logical step. On my knuckles I lower the tie rod mounting position on the knuckle 35mm, this brings the tie rod a lot straighter on a lowered car than it would with a factory knuckle meaning bump steer effect will be lessened.

• Quick steering is incorporated into the modified knuckle design, the distance between the tie rod mounting point and the lower ball joint swivel point on your Lower Control Arm is made shorter making for less leverage and more input from the steering wheel. A factory knuckle may measure around 3-3.5 turns lock to lock whereas a modified knuckle like mine gives you around 2 turns lock to lock, this makes it a lot easier to trace the wheel and make minute adjustments to angle mid corner, it makes drifting a lot easier on the driver. Another benefit to this is the decreased rack travel, there's no longer any need to add rack spacers as your rack will never bottom out because of the increased ratio.

• An added bonus is the harder steering feel associated with the shorter distance between the tie rod mounting point and the lower ball joint swivel point, often S series nissans have a very light steering wheel making it hard for the driver to get a good feel on what the front wheels are doing. The less leverage the knuckle now has on the steering rack because of the modified knuckle makes the feeling of the steering a lot more user friendly

• To sum it up, modified Knuckles and drift cars go hand in hand, bang for buck modifactions on drift cars don’t come much better than these.

• Please note: improper welding and preparation may put your life at risk, only trust people who are qualified and carry the proper certification for such jobs.

[ae86]

just stumbled accross a pair called SUS-made in jp
http://img203.auctions.yahoo.co.jp/users/0/3/9/2/hijuseta219-img480x360-1195552403hijuseta219-img480x360-106734503610220003-red1.jpg
http://img203.auctions.yahoo.co.jp/users/0/3/9/2/hijuseta219-img600x450-1194402838p1010843.jpg

[pen15]

just stumbled accross a pair called SUS-made in jp
http://img203.auctions.yahoo.co.jp/users/0/3/9/2/hijuseta219-img480x360-1195552403hijuseta219-img480x360-106734503610220003-red1.jpg
http://img203.auctions.yahoo.co.jp/users/0/3/9/2/hijuseta219-img600x450-1194402838p1010843.jpg

i seen these a while ago they look alright but still sorta remind me of t3 gear witch i use and i love them im on the less lock setting and mine has a boatload of lock will get pics up soon for a decent reference

[marvis]

What is stock ankerman on AE86 and S13?

[trikzlane]

the akermans is the same throughtout all cars, the inside wheel turns around 10 degrees more the the outside wheel

[ke70dave]

the akermans is the same throughtout all cars, the inside wheel turns around 10 degrees more the the outside wheel

i sure hope not!

how did you come up with that?

[Delazy]

arent T3 knuckles still standard ackerman even with the shorter hole?? therefore still leaving you without the biggest benefit of getting modified knuckles??

[driftke70]

my memory is a bit hazy but setting the akermans from the factory revolves around the center point of the rear axle, so it would change through wheel base and track differences.

The degrees might be similar but the rate it changes through the steering arc would be somewhat different.

[Delazy]

while this thread is bumped up i might aswell update on the NP knuckle situation...

ive got 2 pairs being shipped to me atm, should arrive 2morrow if not monday morning...should have pics online as soon as they arrive...

the design was slightly changed over that of the "heyman" knuckles...mainly to suit the jig/reproduction...

costing will be $150 + shipping, supply your own knuckle...

a pair of them will be in a fairly capable 20v 86 down here in tassie in the coming week or so for "testing"

[worked]

footage will be posted up once testing is done =P

[--Redwork--]

I wa planning on doing a new design this afternoon for my car but time is abit tight...
First thing tomorow. I'll get on it...

First set were 1/3rd factory akerman and standard PS length... didn't get the lock I was locking for but akermans seems good.. so new set will be shorter... 105mm centers and see if I can get it rubing tyres everywhere and 3 turns lock to lock.. :)

[Delazy]

http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc4/hs203.snc4/38492_468647733221_675663221_6401468_6477531_n.jpg

[keiichi]

^ welded under over or face to face?

[corknose]

Id say face to face.

[R&D Mechanical]

http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc4/hs203.snc4/38492_468647733221_675663221_6401468_6477531_n.jpg

Yeah i got the same ones they look great. heaps of lock too!

http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc4/hs185.snc4/37593_10150201903590184_603015183_13285937_866431_ n.jpg
http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash2/hs085.ash2/37593_10150201903595184_603015183_13285938_5681086 _n.jpg

yes kept it appently

[Delazy]

yeh ive seen u drive at mallala dude, absolute nutcase...loved it...fuck the big power nissans...was always waiting for your next pass haha

[--Redwork--]

Just start your entry like 3 meters further back and go in rear first... Your sooooo close...
Thats an epic shoot if you did pull that off..

[SHADOW KNIGHT]

Hey Delazy can Nigel cut and shut xt130 knuckles ???
Would rather get them cut up and keep my power steering arms as spares.
cheers

[Delazy]

yeh he should be able 2, hit him up on his blog or email him...shouldnt be a problem at all...may charge slightly more due to having to make a 2nd jig tho

[R&D Mechanical]

This one is for you delazy :P


http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc3/hs558.snc3/30528_10150159600965184_603015183_12093409_3663855 _n.jpg

[SHADOW KNIGHT]

What an epic pick, thats crazy lock !!!
Delazy just spoke to him he said it doesnt matter at all will fit the hey man jig and coz off the lock stop on the xt130 knuckles will have a bit more meat to weld to !!!!
Now just a case of getting them on my car and seeing wats gunna rub !!!! :)

[Delazy]

This one is for you delazy :P


http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc3/hs558.snc3/30528_10150159600965184_603015183_12093409_3663855 _n.jpg

loves it, but its nothing quite like seeing it in person :P still the most memorable part of coming over for supercup earlier this year :D

[R&D Mechanical]

haha thanks man i hope to come to you soon and skid your track :P

[daviddwilson]

for reference

Power Steering Arms have a spacing (from balljoint to tie rod hole) of 115mm

The updated T3 arms with 2 holes are: outer hole 115mm (same as power steer) and inner hole is 90mm. Super short.

Not sure about the ackerman angle tho.. is that just the difference between the mounting surface and the tie rod mounting surface?
Yer I know hey, when I did that and took the picture I was like. "Cool, both pretty much same angle"

Also note, I am still running a KE70 steering rack, lol.


_____________________
watch movies online (http://moviesonlinefree.biz/)

[blair]

Hey guys, i'm a bit lost as to what i should do / what i've currently got and how i can better it.

Current mods to the front end are 86 unmodified power steering nuckles and xt130 LCA's.
Setup is 1mm toe out each side, maxed stock castor rods and about 3deg camber a side.
14 x 8 -15 with 185/60's. At the rear the tyre comes within 5mm of rail/inner guard. on the front theres heaps of room, except under compression when it has rubbed to bare metal where that annoying cutout for the washer bottle is.
The thing restricting lock is the end of my tierod hitting the LCA. (lockstoppers have been removed).
This happens after only around 1.3/1.4 turns from centre!! on both sides!! so like 2.7 turns lock to lock!!
stock racks are 3.3ish yeh? so am i missing out on lock? even without a rackspacer / extra lock rackends etc?

Anyone else with similar setup got any ideas? what fouls first in your setup etc?

cheers, blair.

[Jacobxxx]

Try a lock spacer

[blair]

Do people install them to remedy my situation? or do they do it because they literally run out of rack travel?

how is extending the amount of rack travel going to stop my tierod from hitting the lca?

is it going to change the pivot point of the tierod enough to pull it away?

[ke_70]

it won't.
run either a notched lca
or a tube style rosejointed lca.

you could how ever be very close to binding the rack up, so you may also need to move the rack.

[johl]

are your lca's bent? how much castor are you running? did this happen all of a sudden? it really doesnt make sense. either your lca's are bent and hitting your steering arm, which they really shouldnt be close with your setup or your flux capacitor needs looking at

[AJPS]

how much caster?

[sundee]

Move the rack foward.
Notch LCA
Build tubular LCA

[benzo]

it won't.
run either a notched lca
or a tube style rosejointed lca.

you could how ever be very close to binding the rack up, so you may also need to move the rack.


Move the rack foward.
Notch LCA
Build tubular LCA

you guys are getting way ahead of yourselves..

with PS arms being the only lock mod, knuckles should not be hitting control-arm. There's something else in this

As Dave and Johl asked, how much castor?

[blair]

Exactly my thoughts man. hence the confusion.

Castor is pulled as far forward as the stock rods will go... bumper had to be trimmed and i get a bit of rub on the front of flared but untrimmed guards.

Did some more testing... seems i was getting myself mixed up with the rack travel.... gets to just under 1.6 turns each way so yer i'm not missing out on too much provided its a regular rack... tie rod issue still inhibits extending rack travel thoug obviously.

Photo bomb!!

Left side:

http://www.ae86drivingclub.com.au/dcimages/1/4/9/256407.jpg

http://www.ae86drivingclub.com.au/dcimages/1/4/9/256408.jpg

http://www.ae86drivingclub.com.au/dcimages/1/4/9/256409.jpg

http://www.ae86drivingclub.com.au/dcimages/1/4/9/256410.jpg

http://www.ae86drivingclub.com.au/dcimages/1/4/9/256411.jpg

http://www.ae86drivingclub.com.au/dcimages/1/4/9/256412.jpg


Right side:

http://www.ae86drivingclub.com.au/dcimages/1/4/9/256413.jpg

http://www.ae86drivingclub.com.au/dcimages/1/4/9/256414.jpg

[AJPS]

where was it jacked up from?

wont the arm angle be different when its flat?

[ke_70]

looks like he's loaded the suspention up with the jack.

i only read the second part haha.

just check for damage. get the measuring tape out. check mount, crossmembers, pull rack boots off see if you don't have a sneaky spacer or anything. check for straightness.
if you're sure they shouldn't be hitting then there must be damage or incorrect parts.

im not really sure how much room there should be. but mine don't hit with 90mm knuckles

[johl]

i think you have a freak rack. have you ever seen the rack. you may have one of brett (purple sr hachi) old ones that they 'modified' with an angle grinder for more teeth?

[keiichi]

did you know that the further you pull your LCA forward for caster the less lock you're going to have.
without looking at your car I could be certain that this is why you're not getting the lock you were hoping for.

[keiichi]

also, you mentioned you had to trim the bumper. only time i had my wheels were that far forward on any of my cars i had converted to s13 suspension and used mx cressida lcas which had the castor arm mount holes further towards the outside which meant that once mounted and the castor arm used all the available thread the lca was at such an angle and it had so much castor that i had to cut into the front of the arch and i couldnt use polyurethane lca bushes because the angle was great and thus the bushing was under alot of load.
this in turn means that if your lca is at an angle like that, your knuckle is either going to straighten out or bump into your LCA sooner, since it is actually now further away and at a greater angle from the rack. on level ground your tire-rods should be coming straight out from the rack not at huge angles.
take some more pics dude, with the wheel off, looking at it from side on and such so we can see the strut angle and lca angle.

[keiichi]

another thing are you certain they are 86 powersteering arms or did someone just tell you they are?
i might be way off here but they look like xt130 arms, the bend in the arm looks pretty steep, if you had straighter arms you know you would have less of a problem obviously.
i was just looking at the ajps kelway cns arms, there is a pic of them next to powersteering arms and those ps arms look quite different to yours.

[sundee]

I was going to say the same thing about the steering arms.. Are they 100% 86?

[blair]

How would I elimate/confirm xt130 or ae86 steering
arms? I'm assuming they have the same strut bolt spacing... Are they same overall length?

Rob ran a bucket load of castor and he didn't have this problem running ps arms, extra lock rack ends and xt130 arms! Hmmph!

[blair]

i think you have a freak rack. have you ever seen the rack. you may have one of brett (purple sr hachi) old ones that they 'modified' with an angle grinder for more teeth?

Nah. Car when I bought it was stock as a rock. Rack has a sticker on it for
Fulcrum with "part number: rr78" on it which I'd say is just reco rack then a number to keep track of their current jobs?

[blinded]

http://www.toycrazy.net/tech/struts.html

[claw]

xt130 arms will actually increse your track a little bit over standard 86 arms, look at the hole patern, 3 holes pretty much inline means 86, if one is off set so as to put the strut furter away from the rail and increase the stub axle angle then its xt130

[boost+k]

thats as much lock as your gonna get with your setup, if you want more you will have to goto steering arms with less ackermann angle, also from those pics it looks like the last 1/4 of your turning is in the dead zone ie tie-rod angles have over-extended and at some point you will try to correct at big lock and you will not be able to turn the steering wheel cause you have no mechanical advance on the steering arms....

i struggle to see why you want more when you say your tyre is 5mm away from hitting the chassis rail???

BUT you should move the rack forward if you want to pull the tie-rods so far they hit the lower arm

[blair]

I dont neccesarily want more lock...

Just trying to understand how poeple fit additional off-the-shelf-parts that increase steering lock (lock spacers and extra lock rack ends), without doing serious mods to other componentry (moving rack forward, cutting a massive chunk out of lca, TUBBING etc is RIDICULOUS) EDIT: even the other arms that give MORE lock etc.... is tubbing / MASSIVE spacing needed?

I see heaps of 86 threads where people list these parts... are they just not utilising the parts at all?

The too much castor arguement is stupid. The 185/60 on effectively 14 x 7 [0] is as mentioned less than 5mm from hitting the rail. What I'm saying is, i have TOO much lock for just power steering arms yes? If i wound the castor back, i would be rubbing the shit out of my rail... do other people that don't run as much castor have this issue?

[lolwat]

and the fact your tierod is hitting LCA, notch it

[ae86 slide]

Blair, my first 86 setup was exactly the same as yours, actually my current 86 is as well now that I think about it.

My first 86 started stock as thy rock. Then I added Corona LCA's and would run out of lock when drifting, then added PS arms and found at first I would hardly ever run out of lock, then when pushing limits would feel it hit full lock (like in your picture it would physically stop). I like that feeling cos there is none of that crazy wheel wobble you see in some datto's at full lock.

My setup looks the same as yours (hitting LCA as well), and I too have trimmed front bumper. I think if it feels ok drifting, run with it, then down the track try some ackerman correcting arms, thats my plan anyway.

[Deeken]

Hey, I too have noticed the same problem in my ae71, I'm running 86 struts with standard ae71 LCA, but with t3 ps arms at the shorter hole.. My full lock is about 1.3 turns from centre both ways I thinkk. But my tie rods also hit my LCAs.. I have a fairly huge lock with just the ps arms.. and my 15x8-4 with 195/50 scrub my inner guard some times.. I get a slight scrubbing on the rear of my front wheel arch too, from the tyre turning outward from the car.. but I think this is due to the lack of castor im running (only like 2.5 even on both sides).

But yes, I too get the tie rod to LCA rubbing lol..

[marvis]

I call that the nissan dance!


;)
\ \ ~


;)
~/ /

;)
\ \ ~


;)
~/ /

[blair]

Blair, my first 86 setup was exactly the same as yours, actually my current 86 is as well now that I think about it.

My first 86 started stock as thy rock. Then I added Corona LCA's and would run out of lock when drifting, then added PS arms and found at first I would hardly ever run out of lock, then when pushing limits would feel it hit full lock (like in your picture it would physically stop). I like that feeling cos there is none of that crazy wheel wobble you see in some datto's at full lock.

My setup looks the same as yours (hitting LCA as well), and I too have trimmed front bumper. I think if it feels ok drifting, run with it, then down the track try some ackerman correcting arms, thats my plan anyway.


Hey, I too have noticed the same problem in my ae71, I'm running 86 struts with standard ae71 LCA, but with t3 ps arms at the shorter hole.. My full lock is about 1.3 turns from centre both ways I thinkk. But my tie rods also hit my LCAs.. I have a fairly huge lock with just the ps arms.. and my 15x8-4 with 195/50 scrub my inner guard some times.. I get a slight scrubbing on the rear of my front wheel arch too, from the tyre turning outward from the car.. but I think this is due to the lack of castor im running (only like 2.5 even on both sides).

But yes, I too get the tie rod to LCA rubbing lol..

Finally some real fucking answers! cheers lads. i'll just rock it for now then :P

[Slidin' 71]

Move the rack foward.
Notch LCA
Build tubular LCA

^^^That's if you want to waste a shitload of money.

Or Blair, you could just get some quality cut n shut knuckles (under $100, or else you're getting ripped blind) and it will solve all the problems you are having as the ackerman correction will move the tie rod end further away from the control arm on lock.

[trikzlane]

^^^That's if you want to waste a shitload of money.

Or Blair, you could just get some quality cut n shut knuckles (under $100, or else you're getting ripped blind) and it will solve all the problems you are having as the ackerman correction will move the tie rod end further away from the control arm on lock.

some times its a little better to pay a bit more to get someone who knows there shit, then a 17yr old who "can" weld

[KurtHS]

Leigh's probably referring to JDI Fabrications knuckles, can't fault anything on them, dudes a shithot fabricator.

[Slidin' 71]

some times its a little better to pay a bit more to get someone who knows there shit, then a 17yr old who "can" weld

Lol, if people are fine with paying more than that for an hour or so labour than that's fine. But I would suggest to most people to do some research before paying for knuckles as some people are charging exorbitant amounts for the work they're getting, especially if there has been no r+d involved in designing them.

And by the way, the only knuckles I know of under $100 are made by probably the most qualified welder/fabricator in the country that makes knuckles. If you're buying parts that have been modified like cut'n'shut knuckles it would be worthwhile finding out who has designed them and also who is fabricating them. As a failure with a part like this would have some disastrous consequences.

[elda_bob]

I call that the nissan dance!


;)
\ \ ~


;)
~/ /

;)
\ \ ~


;)
~/ /
should see his dance that goes with it.

[Golberg]

For all those suggesting that shortening the steering arms further in this instance is going to increase lock... take a step back and think about it. By shortening the arms you're actually going to decrease the available lock because the arm will bind against the control arm sooner in the steering arc. The reason for going shorter steering arms is change the lever ratio of the arm thus achieving further steering travel with the same rack. The downside of this is increased steering effort. So in otherwords if your steering arm hits the control arm before the rack actually comes to the end of its travel you're wasting steering effort for no gain.

In summary, if blair were to run shorter arms than what he has now, it'd simply result in less lock and greater steering effort.

There is something to be said about changing the ackerman angle you'd potentially gain more lock, but you'd see bigger results with a notched LCA and relocated rack as has been suggested.

[ae86 slide]

So who are the people we talk to about getting arms modified?
How do you get hold of JDI?
Ive got P/S arms I wanna get the ackerman cut out.

[johl]

Don't use your ps arms. I sold my old ones and got jdi ones and it didnt cost me anything in the end. I can't remember who the guy was that contacted me about it but if you search my threads I put up a wtb about it. I would go there and get his name but I'm on my iPhone

[Slidin' 71]

For all those suggesting that shortening the steering arms further in this instance is going to increase lock... take a step back and think about it. By shortening the arms you're actually going to decrease the available lock because the arm will bind against the control arm sooner in the steering arc. The reason for going shorter steering arms is change the lever ratio of the arm thus achieving further steering travel with the same rack. The downside of this is increased steering effort. So in otherwords if your steering arm hits the control arm before the rack actually comes to the end of its travel you're wasting steering effort for no gain.

In summary, if blair were to run shorter arms than what he has now, it'd simply result in less lock and greater steering effort.

There is something to be said about changing the ackerman angle you'd potentially gain more lock, but you'd see bigger results with a notched LCA and relocated rack as has been suggested.

No one has suggested just shortening the steering arms, the biggest gains from knuckles is the reduced ackerman angle which will actually gain you tie rod to lca clearance on lock. Hence getting more lock (and more front end grip and better feel also).

With notching the lca and moving the rack forward you would gain a little lock but for alot of effort/cost. Or you could just change knuckles, leave the rack in the standard position and not touch the lca. And you would gain massive amounts of lock (if you had enough tyre to castor rod clearance). And the benifit of better front grip and feel, which you wouldn't get with natched lca and moved rack.

[Slidin' 71]

So who are the people we talk to about getting arms modified?
How do you get hold of JDI?
Ive got P/S arms I wanna get the ackerman cut out.

For all JDI knuckle enquires contact Inverse tyres, all there details are here: http://www.facebook.com/inversetyres.

[Hachi_Tom]

Blair have you checked that it is actually the tierod hitting the lca that is limited lock? check if the tie rod ball joint thingo stops on the end of the rack.
i am using corona knuckles (125mm bolt spacing) with 22mm longer LCA's (no camber tops, guessing around 2-2.5 degrees of camber), maxed out caster rods, when i got an alignment it was about 5.5 degrees, with a lock spacer i made that allows 25mm extra rack travel. (longer than the ajps ones)
running performance hurricanes (8j -10) with 185/60's

i would say i have about the same if not a little bit more lock than you, i was running into the same problems as you, front scrapes on the tub, rear scrapes on the inner guard/tub/rail whatever that part is (this was when i had standard lca's, fixed it with longer lca's), and the brake line where it comes through.
i also had problems like castor rod bolts hitting the strut bolts, might want to check that isnt hitting,


another thing i can think of is that physically the xt130 LCAs might be thicker than standard ones? i have never measured that shit so i wouldnt know, might be something to check.

only pictures i have of my lock for reference

http://www.ae86drivingclub.com.au/dcimages/4/2/5/9/260631.jpg
http://i657.photobucket.com/albums/uu291/Timmy_hayward666/IMAG0200.jpg

[stx-16]

does anyone know of a god diy article on making knuckles

ps im not welding them myself i can't weld for shit haha

[Delazy]

Why bother with DIY knuckles when proven/cheap options are readily available in Australia? Leighs JDI knuckles are mint! Back when I paid $350-$400 for my heyman knuckles these options weren't around! That money would now nearly buy 4 pairs!

[--Redwork--]

Ae86 knuckles are hands down the easiest to modify.. So simple..

My current setup. Is cut knuckles. a fair amount shorter and roughly 1/3 the factory angle. Adjustable LCA that I have MASSIVELY notched and is wound out almost as fat as it will go. relocated castor arm. AJPS lock spacer And moved the rack for approximately 25-30mm
With the setup the way it is now My tyre rubs the chassis and I still have rack travel left. To gain more angle I need to make the LCA longer. Which requires cutting and adding and also I need to find longer rack ends.. Using celica ones at the moment which are longer then 86 but need to be even longer again.

Also considering another set of knuckles. with 0 or even anti ackerman. and not as short.. Which will allow more angle befor bind aswell..
http://www.ae86drivingclub.com.au/dcimages/1/3/2/8/261128.jpg
http://www.ae86drivingclub.com.au/dcimages/1/3/2/8/261129.jpg

And this is another issure I run into if I run rediculas castor.. Roughly 10 degrees in this pic..
http://www.ae86drivingclub.com.au/dcimages/1/3/2/8/261130.jpg

[stx-16]

Why bother with DIY knuckles when proven/cheap options are readily available in Australia? Leighs JDI knuckles are mint! Back when I paid $350-$400 for my heyman knuckles these options weren't around! That money would now nearly buy 4 pairs!

do jdi make s13 knuckles?
how much?
will it be less then $100
probably not
and the guy im getting to weld mine is 59 years old and has owned his own metal workshop for a bit over 30 years so i have 100% faith in his welds

[boost+k]

man you guys come up with some funny shit, notching the lower arms is about the stupidest thing you can do, at that point in the travel you have NO mechanical advantage over the steering arm, so when you do get to that much lock you can't pull it back out :DD

and a corolla chassis does not require over 5 degress of caster, thats for dirty nissans with a completely different front end setup....

really if you don't understand how all this shit interacts your shouldn't be modding it... and just so you know i'm not talking shit like the all the dudes showing you there mad extreme lock when the car is jacked up,(real lock is shown on the ground) here is a action pic of my lock while competing in my ke70 (d1nz rookie) and i have control at this lock :cool:

23139

[Delazy]

do jdi make s13 knuckles?
how much?
will it be less then $100
probably not
and the guy im getting to weld mine is 59 years old and has owned his own metal workshop for a bit over 30 years so i have 100% faith in his welds

Jdi does everything...and are tested/proven...no simply I'll cut here, weld there and try this :)
Ae86, ke70, silvia, skyline, chaser etc etc

[stx-16]

link me



man you guys come up with some funny shit, notching the lower arms is about the stupidest thing you can do, at that point in the travel you have NO mechanical advantage over the steering arm, so when you do get to that much lock you can't pull it back out :DD

and a corolla chassis does not require over 5 degress of caster, thats for dirty nissans with a completely different front end setup....
23139


ok well in stead of getting up on your high horse how about you teach us on what to do then

[boost+k]

i already did a few pages back.... but basically reduce your achkerman, and fit stoppers to limit the rack ends from getting too close to the lower arm... after that is trail and error to see what suits your driving style, but over 5degrees caster on a ke70 setup is horrible IMO

and if you read between the lines everything else is there, i'm not trying to be on a high horse, just point out things you shouldn't do, cause i've seen too many people stuck on/in the wall wondering why

other than that i would have to type about two pages if info that people would only skim over and probably miss the important bits, a little knowledge is a dangerous thing especially when it comes to steering systems, personally i have about 5 different deigns for corolla's alone, and before selling any of them i have a talk to the owner about use of car and try and get a feel for there driving style and how competent they are... don't even get me started on s-chassis crap

[stx-16]

well mine is on a r31 with s13 front end and i am not paying 300+ for driftworks knuckles

if you do a write up i will read every word i really like lerning new stuff about steering systems or if you have a link to a good site/thread that would be nice to share aswell

[Slidin' 71]

link me



I'm guessing this was referring to JDI Knuckles, If so head to http://www.facebook.com/InverseTyres for any JDI Knuckle enquires.

Also boost+k seems to be on the ball, it takes a bit of trial and error to get each setup perfected. And alot of times one spec won't suit all customers.

And driftworks are more then $300 and require offset spacers and possibly more items. JDI s13 knuckles are $200 changeover and don't require anything else other than slip on rack spacers, and in some cases longer tie rods which are sub-$50 a pair.

[johl]

alternatively you can bend the ackerman out of the standard p/s arms. this is very dodgy but it does work and i have seen it work, but for me, i went jdi knuckles

[claw]

bending something in your steering is fucking stupid, i hope whoever did it has a knuckle snap to teach them to do something so retarded

[Hachi_Tom]

man you guys come up with some funny shit, notching the lower arms is about the stupidest thing you can do, at that point in the travel you have NO mechanical advantage over the steering arm, so when you do get to that much lock you can't pull it back out :DD



if you have to notch your LCA's you normally move the rack forward..... to stop binding (having no mechanical advantage over the steering arm)

[lolwat]

bending something in your steering is fucking stupid, i hope whoever did it has a knuckle snap to teach them to do something so retarded

your in a thread, with people talking abou chopping and rewelding steering arms, heating and bending who gives a fuck

anyone got pics of X members with racks moved forward (ae86 ofcourse)

[KurtHS]

There's a huge difference between bending and cutting+welding...

[johl]

taken from jase's build thread who posted on the previous page
http://www.forums.secretdrift.com.au/index.php?showtopic=37475&st=0&start=0

rack is forward 30mm
http://www.ae86drivingclub.com.au/dcimages/7/3/261199.jpg

his own modified knuckle on top vs stock on bottom
http://www.ae86drivingclub.com.au/dcimages/7/3/261200.jpg

[claw]

chopping and rewelding is a damn sight safer and stronger than bending, clearly you have no idea how metal works, if somethings bent, its weakened, it will bend again

[claw]

oh, and bending several times on a think solid peice of steel ultimately means SNAPPING, if you want your shit to snap, by all means bend it, or run the knuckles that have been breaking at track days in victoria

[boost+k]

if you have to notch your LCA's you normally move the rack forward..... to stop binding (having no mechanical advantage over the steering arm)
but there is only so far you can move your rack before other things get in the way like the bush and arm itself, so there is no way you can go past the straight of the arm and have any mechanical advantage left... so no reason to notch the arm

(even if you change the bush to a rose-joint and also offset mounting point on the crossmember you will still only get the tie-rod in line with the arm, so you still really need a 7-10mm stopper, even better if you use a stopper that is raised and stops the steering arm not the ball-joint)

(i've run a moved rack for a fair few years now) since back when i was drifting with a k series, you should move the rack on any setup you are getting the bail-joint near the lower control arm

[--Redwork--]

I don't understand how you can say there is no advantage to notching the LCA..?
My LCA have a pretty massive amount missing, and my set up only just goes into bind when the rack end buttoms out in the LCA... And due to not having long enough rack ends I have to have my LCA shorter than I'd like which means my wheels rub the rail befor that any way..

But I do agree with most other things.
An very basic setup of Lock spacer and angle corrected arms results in heaps of lock..
And also as you said. There is little point to making them too short..

[boost+k]

maybe mspaint can help explain better?
you barely have any mech advantage when hitting the lower control arm at full lock (if any), most people drive around this using weight transfer and caster to pull them out, but when you get it slightly wrong you can't pull it out of the slide when you want

http://www.ae86drivingclub.com.au/dcimages/2/6/0/4/261215.jpg

[Hachi_Tom]

if you have moved the rack as forward as possible, and you have notched the lca's and you run into binding issues, you are clearly doing something wrong
the wheel would be hitting the rack end before it binds........ or something else ridiculous

[--Redwork--]

But just look at the awesome angle differnce :)
http://www.ae86drivingclub.com.au/dcimages/2/6/0/4/261215.jpg[/QUOTE]

Tom I'm not sure what your implying.??
Moving rack forward = less chance of bind.
Notching LCA = more chance of bind..

And As I've already said. My setup phiscally can't go into bind because the wheel runs out of room to turn.. If I had no wheel then yes it can and does bind. Mind you the angle this acheives is fairly stupid...
Annnndddd I'm pretty sure I did mention that I can over come this with a slightly differnt knuckle design and longer LCA when I can find an appropriate rack end to give me the length I need.

[Hachi_Tom]

Tom I'm not sure what your implying.??
Moving rack forward = less chance of bind.
Notching LCA = more chance of bind..

can't go into bind because the wheel runs out of room to turn.. If I had no wheel then yes it can and does bind.

not sure where you got that first part from
second bit about not being able to go into bind is what i was trying to say.

[boost+k]

redwork, so ideally you should fit some sort of stopper just before your wheel contacts the inner guard/rail, and then your on the safe side of binding, i've seen alot of munted tyres from rails and inner guards, (when you spin or get carried away then the wheel will end up turning further than you want and mashing into something)

oh and that pic is with a already moved rack, any further forward and the inner rack-end pivot will hit the bolt for the lower arm on its way past...

longer inner rack ends i use are from a townace van (could prob dig out p/n if your really keen)

[--Redwork--]

Always keen to develope the set up more.. PN would be great.. also some dementions would be awesome to. so I caould see how much longer they are than my current ones.
Its only the first stage of development.. Now I know what to do to make it better. Just like the rest of my car.. There is always some thing to improve..

[boost+k]

pretty sure its camelot part : TE 489L, 82-85 townace m/s, p/s is fatter, will measure next time im under there, but its quite long, also come in a 80's camry

[--Redwork--]

Cool.. Will run that past my parts guys next time I see them..

[AJPS]

pretty sure its camelot part : TE 489L, 82-85 townace m/s, p/s is fatter, will measure next time im under there, but its quite long, also come in a 80's camry

te489l

is a t18/ke30 etc outer tie rod end

I think youre referring to a rack end? Which start in REXXX

[boost+k]

woops, right you are, my notes are scribbles, on further inspection p/n is RE 883

[--Redwork--]

So I finally got round to dropping in to see my mates at Fulcrum..
Your part number RE883 is the same as what I'm running now re878..
But a quick look found that RE882 comes in at around 50mm longer. So I have some of them on the way..
Once the xmas break is over I'll make up some new tubular arms that are a suitable length and everything should be apples.. :)

[--Redwork--]

Just to confirm for you boys that want to run wide track for more wheel clearence.

RE883/RE878 (same part) is from memmory about 20mm longer than stock
And RE882 which is from a cressida so they're everywhere :) comes in at 60mm longer than the re883 rack ends..

[Alexrex7]

What other mods will i need if i put AE86 power steering or JID ones in my KE70?

[Delazy]

Ae86/t18 struts, brakes, shock insert and springs...

Steering arm pcd is different...

Or other option is that u supply jdi with ke70 steering knuckles to cut and shut, which would allow u to keep ur current strut setup

[Alexrex7]

okay so will i need to change my LCA's aswell?

[corknose]

http://25.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m59vaniaK21r3tmw0o1_400.gif

[Golberg]

okay so will i need to change my LCA's aswell?

No.

[R&D Mechanical]

JDI knuckles and kelway/ajps rose jointed control arms stock castor rods SHOCKWORKS suspension

Love it, this setup has saved me so many times from going that little bit too far

http://www.ae86drivingclub.com.au/dcimages/522340.jpg
http://www.ae86drivingclub.com.au/dcimages/522341.jpg

[claw]

jdi knuckles are the best, had ke70 ones with rack spacers and xt130 arms, then went to 86 coilovers with 86 knuckles, ran 14x7 +8s the whole time which reduced lock capabilities insanely but anyone who steered my car was amazed at the lock it still had, and i was so far from full rack travel it wasnt funny. So much lock, apeshit front grip, ill be running same setup in my corona if it ever gets rego

[Archie4812]

has anyone had any expirience resolving steering going over centre or binding?

[Delazy]

I dnt think anyone has encountered the problem running as86 suspension...

[Archie4812]

damn, i have it but only on the right side, but i have s13 front end, which may be why

[Delazy]

damn, i have it but only on the right side, but i have s13 front end, which may be why

that's your problem then...

[Archie4812]

real question is, how do i stop it?, longer lcas?

[--Redwork--]

Offset rack spacers. or move rack forward.

[Sprinter Freak]

Does anyone know the exact specks of the jdi knuckles? i.e. the spacing and locations of the holes? just cause i have a set of ps arms but not too keen on getting them hacked up, so was thinking of maybe getting a set made up. Anyone have an idea of how much it might cost to get a pair made up?

[johl]

sell your power steering ones and get standard ones which no one wants then send them to jdi and it costs $160. you'l break even in the end, thats what i did. keep in mind these knuckles are not for street use and it is stamped on them so if anything happens on the street its on you

[keiichi]

damn, i have it but only on the right side, but i have s13 front end, which may be why

If you have it only on one side it is an inproper wheel alignment. Many aligners will center you steering on the steering wheel which is ignorant of the abuse our cars take. You need to have it aligned so you have even lock left to right and THEN have the steering wheel removed and put back on center.

[Archie4812]

If you have it only on one side it is an inproper wheel alignment. Many aligners will center you steering on the steering wheel which is ignorant of the abuse our cars take. You need to have it aligned so you have even lock left to right and THEN have the steering wheel removed and put back on center.

sweet as cheers heaps, will have to get this done :)

[Sprinter Freak]

sell your power steering ones and get standard ones which no one wants then send them to jdi and it costs $160. you'l break even in the end, thats what i did. keep in mind these knuckles are not for street use and it is stamped on them so if anything happens on the street its on you

yea was thinking i could do that as well. guess ill just try to grab a set of standard knuckles and send them to jdi. yea wasnt planning to use them on the street.

[Skid_KE70]

Here is my front end setup - Car is track only.

PBM Coilovers
Nigel Petrie Cut & Shut Knuckles
Rack Spacer
Self Made Notched Lower Control Arms
Notched Chassis Rails
AJPS Tie Rod Ends
No Swaybar
Rosejointed cast rods with flush Head Bolts

http://imageshack.us/a/img198/56/lock3a.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/198/lock3a.jpg/)

http://imageshack.us/a/img819/7195/lock2b.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/819/lock2b.jpg/)

[ke_70]

havn't left yourself much room there with the chassis notching.
and have you strengthend that much at all?

[Skid_KE70]

Yes, reinforced internally and the engine bay/strut towers etc are all stitch welded.

[marvis]

Bump!