Grip tips/lessons

[shadow_bunny]

Hey guys, you know how there's a Drift Bible....is there a Grip Bible? Or some sort of video to learn basic skills? I've already tried the old fashioned way, I really need some pointers.

[Gunner]

best way to learn is by doing, join a car clu, go out and try some events, someone will always be happy to tell you where your going wrong

[Chairs with flares]

If you really want it outlined; read the Physics of Racing series of articles by Brian Beckman. It breaks everything down into small understandable chunks.

http://phors.locost7.info/contents.htm

:-)

[shadow_bunny]

best way to learn is by doing, join a car clu, go out and try some events, someone will always be happy to tell you where your going wrong


If you really want it outlined; read the Physics of Racing series of articles by Brian Beckman. It breaks everything down into small understandable chunks.

http://phors.locost7.info/contents.htm

:-)
Thanks guys, so far someone's told me that racing in just one lane of the road is not good, although I'm scared of using both. By the way, has anyone here been to a driving school, and is it worth it?

[Clint]

From personal experience, you'll learn a heap more from actually getting out of the car and track marshalling - you'll see the different lines people take, different entry speeds to corners, and their attitude when exiting too, all of which you can correspond to their times. This gives you a great start to becoming a better/faster driver, and it's free aside from your time.

Once you step into the car, my basic recommendations are to let the car's torque work for you, and slow everything down. By that I mean - let the car do the work. It's all well and good to fight a car around a corner, but it won't be fast. Pick your entry speed and your line and you'll fast discover the "fast line" around a corner. it is after all the corners that will improve a driver's lap time - as Colin McRae once said - "Straights are for fast cars, corners are for fast drivers"

All the above information is great to get you out there and having fun, but tuition from an experienced driver is also a great help, and tuition for several experineced drivers is even better - you'll soon pick what works for your driving style.

My experineced recommendation is to start driving in some local motorkhanas/speed series near you. Also volunteer to marshall for these events and correlate the cars times to their approach to corners and exit strategies - you can help yourself as much as any instructor can in this environment.

[Joel-AE86]

Word Clint (aka CLG?)

No better way to learn something then getting out there (on the track) and giving it a go. If you are really concentrating and taking it all in, you will learn many ways to improve your lap times before requiring instructions of how to really cut them down.

The two basics that I believe are important to developing faster grip driving when starting out are:

1. Smooth is fast: Try and always give smooth input into the car, especially with braking, steering and gear changes. When down-shifting, learn to match the engine and gearbox revs for each gear. This gives better braking and corner entry control whilst being gentle on your car. I've seen in horror club days at Mallala where so many drivers in cars such as porsche GT3's can not rev match coming into a tight corner. It is very jerky, uncontrolled and can tear shit out of your engine and box.

2. Find the right line, and maximise your speed out of the corner: Self explainatory. As Clint said, you can pick up very quickly watching people drive a track to see what is and isn't a fast line through a corner.

I'm not a great grip driver myself as I have mainly focused on drift, however there are many common skills shared between the two disciplines (as with any two driving disciplines).

Good luck, and have fun!

[DX20VT]

Word Clint (aka CLG?)

When down-shifting, learn to match the engine and gearbox revs for each gear. This gives better braking and corner entry control whilst being gentle on your car. I've seen in horror club days at Mallala where so many drivers in cars such as porsche GT3's can not rev match coming into a tight corner. It is very jerky, uncontrolled and can tear shit out of your engine and box.


How do you do this?

[focus_7]

heel + toe braking. Bump the revs up while the clutch is in and youre applying the brakes.

[45aken]

A simple tip from some pro guys at the track when i first started was count around 2 seconds from when you would normally turn in on the road, then turn in.

and smooth is fast.
But get out there on some track days, most people will help you out if you go to a good one. I had some auscar driver who was showing a guy in his new 360 how to drive offer to jump in the passenger set in my car and show me some tricks, which was a great experience.

[ThatsHowWeRoll]

A rather well known racer once told me his 'secret to his success was he set the car up to understeer just a little....he is famous for his corner speeds..

Otherwise just go to a trackday with experienced fellas and get some tips...

[blair]

A simple tip from some pro guys at the track when i first started was count around 2 seconds from when you would normally turn in on the road, then turn in.

and smooth is fast.
But get out there on some track days, most people will help you out if you go to a good one. I had some auscar driver who was showing a guy in his new 360 how to drive offer to jump in the passenger set in my car and show me some tricks, which was a great experience.

he IS doing this on the road.

not the best tip lol!!

[DX20VT]

heel + toe braking. Bump the revs up while the clutch is in and youre applying the brakes.

Thought that was what you meant, and I wouldn't recommend it.
Tried it and I dont like it, plus I'm usually so hard on the brakes
that I dont want to take any pressure off the pedal or else I'm past the corner,
and I dont consider myself a late braker.
Only reason I can see to do it is that your syncros are rooted.

I believe a better thing to do is brake, slow down, then down change.
So many people downchange almost as soon as they start to brake,
which is hard on gear, can lock the rears, and causes massive engine revs.

[45aken]

It works well on the road too,
Helps you stop coming in too hot when your over eager to hit the apex.

[blair]

^ for someone with a bit of an idea yeh, but im honestly not sure this bloke has much going on up there?

who needs to ask if its ok to drive on the wrong side of the road?

im making an asumtion but i dont think he has the confidence/ability to brake 2 seconds later than he thinks he should.

at 100km/hr thats 30M
if up a mountain thats a big thing.


Thanks guys, so far someone's told me that racing in just one lane of the road is not good, although I'm scared of using both. By the way, has anyone here been to a driving school, and is it worth it?

[45aken]

Yeah my bad,
I though he just needed some help at the track.
Failed to read he was doing it on the road.

Please,
For the sake of mine and everyone else's friends and family refrain from "racing" on public roads. Save that shit for the track where you can't hit a mini van carrying a mother and her 3 kids.

[kaibeecee]

A rather well known racer once told me his 'secret to his success was he set the car up to understeer just a little....he is famous for his corner speeds..

Otherwise just go to a trackday with experienced fellas and get some tips...

why be all secretive, name names. no shame here man.

the one thing i can comment on, is its to best to use smoother braking earlier and get a better line out of the corner rather than going in all fast and sketchy and having to lean on it hard to gain pace on the exit.

but as said, just drive and learn, read books. take what you read and put it to practice, cause at the end of the day you can read and hypothesize about it 24/7 but without putting it to physical use, it's not doing s**t for you

[Joel-AE86]

I believe a better thing to do is brake, slow down, then down change.
So many people downchange almost as soon as they start to brake,
which is hard on gear, can lock the rears, and causes massive engine revs.

You don't always have to downshift coming into a corner, you have to assess the exit speed and the gear you need to exit...Just watch F1 drivers.

The main benefits to downshifting coming into tighter corners:

1. Uses the engine as a source of braking to take some load off the brakes
2. It ensures you are in the right gear in the right time as you exit the corner (rather then coasting through the corner...then having to shift whilst cornering, when you could be accelerating)

It is a skill to shift smoothly, whilst braking at the optimal rate and time coming into a corner...but it is the best time to do it to ensure your engine and gearbox are ready to start laying down some power as you exit the corner.

REV matching is the only safe way to downshift to ensure smooth braking and corner entry, balancing your car's weight and taking care of your engine and gearbox.

Not rev matching is a common way to kill your engine by forcing it rotate from the drivetrain. It doesn't matter how much rev-cut protection you have on your ignition, if you shift fast from say 3rd to 2nd at speed, your engine may be forced to rotate 1000's of rpm faster then your rev-limiter is set to. Ensuing compression locking and shock loading causing high stress on components such as rods.

SMOOTHER IS BETTER!

[Rice86]

Thought that was what you meant, and I wouldn't recommend it.
Tried it and I dont like it, plus I'm usually so hard on the brakes
that I dont want to take any pressure off the pedal or else I'm past the corner,
and I dont consider myself a late braker.
Only reason I can see to do it is that your syncros are rooted.

I believe a better thing to do is brake, slow down, then down change.
So many people downchange almost as soon as they start to brake,
which is hard on gear, can lock the rears, and causes massive engine revs.

lol thats exactly why they use heel-toe, to rev match so they DONT lock the rears

you brake to slow down then down gear is a slow method, hence its not practical for grip, slow slow slow, grip u want fast fast fast

so heel-toe, keeps revs up in the correct gear while downshifting, reason, better braking into a corner/acceleration out of a corner. if not performed properly will cause car to jerk, lock, massive engine revs for nothing

i grip drive a lot on the road, not saying im pro, but ive done it for a long time now to know a bit more then average joe that thinks fast cars means they drive fast

[Rice86]

and using double lane helps a lot with mild suspension work, or i should say 1 and a half lanes

if ur running coil overs, good tyres etc etc etc, single lane is what you should only need on the road, where as cut or lowered springs, dead shocks, ok tyres, they dont hold girp much so u take wider lanes to compisate for its lost...

i dont meant o promote road racing but its no secret that we all do it...so DONT do it on the road

im still waiting for my first track day so i can apply what i already know onto the track and only hope to get better

[Moebius]

The main benefits to downshifting coming into tighter corners:

1. Uses the engine as a source of braking to take some load off the brakes


Engine braking will not slow you down as fast as just using the brakes so there's no point doing it unless your brakes are stuffed and can't cope with the heat.

[blair]

^ how can using your engine and brakes at the same time to slow you down

be SLOWER then just using your brakes?

fucken lol.

[DX20VT]

^ how can using your engine and brakes at the same time to slow you down

be SLOWER then just using your brakes?

fucken lol.

It can't.

I know if I miss the gear gate or have a slow down shift,
it stuffs the whole corner as you cant slow enough at the right time,
even though the rear brakes on my car are well up to the task.,

I have done a fair amount of circuit racing, but wouldn't say I'm an expert,
Just my opinion that rev matching or heel+ toe braking is not something that is right up there on the list of things you need to learn,
but in saying that I never got the hang of left foot braking apart from rolling starts either, even though it does hav it's advantages in places.

On a side note, ever tried heel + toe braking in a car with a pedal box and no brake booster?




Seem to have started an interesting discussion here...

[Joel-AE86]

Engine braking will not slow you down as fast as just using the brakes so there's no point doing it unless your brakes are stuffed and can't cope with the heat.

I'm not saying that 'engine braking' makes you brake faster, but it does have its advantages. One being that it reduces heat on your brakes, and in some situations, even with decent brakes this is advantageous to maintain a constant pedal feel and consistent braking application. The other advantage is that is can actually provide grip and balance in the rear as you have a resistance of the engine revs acting on the rear treads (kind of like having more brake bias to the rear).

I think heel+toe braking is a skill worth learning when you start out. It feels sketchy for a while trying to get the feel for both pedals with one foot.

DX20VT: No I've never tried heel+toe with said brake setup, however I used to run SR20DET brakes on my AE86 with a stock booster and master and I had a very soft pedal feel. So much so that I had to change my braking style. I prefer braking with my toes and hitting the accel with my heel, but I used to have to brake with my heel and accel with my toe so I could reach the accel.

[--Redwork--]

to quote old Micky Doohan...

Braking later is awesome... means you get to go fast longer :)

My only experiance with track racing is at the go cars...
And I think everone finds the right line at go karts very quickly... Mostly cause 9 time out of 10 your on the track with ppl who have done it befor and you follow them..
But I found... and this is somewhat depressing... Going slow is faster...
At the Karts ( kingston ) you can virtually hold it flat the whole time apart from braking at the end of the straight and quick tap of the brake on one of the other tight corners...
When you come to the corners you can just throw it it and it'll slide around and then out the other side you go....

But.. if you slow down a little on the entry you can hold a better line and have a higher exit speed...Making you overall quicker.. Even though you could have done it floored the whole way...

It all comes down to what everyone else has said so far.... BE SMOOTH...
keep the car balanced and flowing and you will be quick...

[Rice86]

SUPER LATE BREAKING TECHNIUQE !!

every corner has a speed limit, and every corner is different, so depends what track/road ur on, different skills are needed, but its always good to learn as much as you can rather then saying heel-toe is useless when i can just use the brakes, if thats ur style then MAD, go for gold, late braking will only be most useful on track then on road, on road braking early gives u better time then braking late...lol if no one has noticed, braking is a top level skill that you'll will most likly never perfect unless ur a actuall driver and thats all you do.. to know when exactly to brake and how much, only experince will tell you how much you really know

[Joel-AE86]

Horses for Courses.

[skit]

Thought that was what you meant, and I wouldn't recommend it.
Tried it and I dont like it, plus I'm usually so hard on the brakes
that I dont want to take any pressure off the pedal or else I'm past the corner,
and I dont consider myself a late braker.
Only reason I can see to do it is that your syncros are rooted.

I believe a better thing to do is brake, slow down, then down change.
So many people downchange almost as soon as they start to brake,
which is hard on gear, can lock the rears, and causes massive engine revs.

I'm a little confused. Your method sounds safe & easiest for learning, but doesn't seem to make sense in racing/track day terms where lap times are important.

If you are not a "late braker", why are you so hard on the brakes?

I can only interpret this as meaning that you brake hard, a long way before the entry point, then release the brake, select a lower gear, then coast in riding the clutch to get a smooth transition in drive - because you are not rev matching - then turning into the corner.

Any way I think about it, rev matching - done correctly - reduces the total time between the beginning of brake application, to the end of getting off the clutch after selecting a lower gear.

It doesn't need to be said, but minimising time spent off the brakes or off the throttle is a key way to improve lap times, among other tips mentioned. Therefore coasting while releasing the clutch slowly, instead of rev matching, takes additional time & is ultimately slower.

Not having a dig at you, just offering my thoughts; I believe heel/toe is a valuable skill. Yes the penalty is sometimes high if you miss shift at the last moment though. If so, trail brake ftw, and grab your lower gear at the next available opportunity. It can make for some uncomfortable moments, though, I agree.

Personally I find rev matching easier with heavier brake pedals than lighter, power assisted brake systems. If the pedal box system you speak of has such a heavy pedal, then I wonder if the cylinder bore combination is not sized appropriately & excessive pedal force is required.

Regarding the statement by someone about using both sides of the "road" equally. I've seen Initial D, own up & confess. This is not the first time I have heard manga downhill racing cartoon speak come up in proper "driving technique" discussions. Can it, please.

[Rice86]

lol its not technique, use the amount of space u got for better line, only idiots drive on the wrong side of the road...

anything can happen, but are less likly to if you know the condition and enivronment before hand and drive to a safe manner..no such thing as safe speeding, but is smart driving

[choonga]

re: people not understanding heel toe... *palm to face*

[ThatsHowWeRoll]

i heel toe because in a race situation you dont want to worry about how your releasing the clutch and compression lock ups etc....a correct rev-match enbales a quick seemless change with a dumping of the clutch and leaves time to concentrate on other things....and it sounds mad.

[Joel-AE86]

Changing gears is by nature a waste of time...if you are not accelerating, you should be braking until you can return to accelerating. Time spend neither accelerating or braking for activities such as changing gears should be minimised.

It can't be any simpler to try and absorb the otherwise wasteful time of down-shifting in your braking time...and of course do it smoothly to not disrupt effective braking.

/End of heel+toe discussion.

[Jase86]

Changing gears is by nature a waste of time...if you are not accelerating, you should be braking until you can return to accelerating. Time spend neither accelerating or braking for activities such as changing gears should be minimised.

It can't be any simpler to try and absorb the otherwise wasteful time of down-shifting in your braking time...and of course do it smoothly to not disrupt effective braking.

/End of heel+toe discussion.

:thumbup: Finally someone who knows what they are talking about.

One of the first things my instructor told me when I started racing was that you should never be coasting! You should be either hard on the throttle or hard on the brakes!(Corner exit and sweepers excepted)

Another thing which was taught to me when I first started driving was that you should always be in the correct gear at all times - makes it easy to suddenly get back on the throttle in an instant and drive out of a situation if required. Easiest way to accomplish both of these is with heel-toe downshifting. I'm so used to doing it now that I do it without thinking in all manual vehicles I drive - even the old crappy column shift work van!

[Chairs with flares]

im making an asumtion but i dont think he has the confidence/ability to brake 2 seconds later than he thinks he should.

at 100km/hr thats 30M
if up a mountain thats a big thing.

I think he's talking about the late apex line, where you brake and turn in deeper into the corner moving your turn-in, apex and exit points further along the corner. While this sharpens your driving line slightly, it essentially turns your line into an increasing radius curve, so you can get on the LOL pedal earlier onto a straight.

The opposite is early-apexing, which turns the driving line into a decreasing radius curve. This isn't really useful unless you have a straight onto a section of consecutive tight corners where you want to hold as much speed as you can before the first of the corners.

:thumbup:

[45aken]

^^
precisely,
Works great on the road/track in a evo/wrx, you can come in with the brakes a tad late which gets you a good front grip/turn in, overcoming the cars initial understeer and then get on throttle early (also overcoming understeer).
Best technique i've been taught.

I dont know what this whole heel toe debate is about?

1) Keeps car stable while downshifting
2) Allows braking while downshifting
3) Something
4) Profit

[filfilfil]

Make sure your seat position is correct...ie able to hold the top of the steering wheel with one hand without your shoulder coming off the back of the seat...

[blair]

I think he's talking about the late apex line, where you brake and turn in deeper into the corner moving your turn-in, apex and exit points further along the corner. While this sharpens your driving line slightly, it essentially turns your line into an increasing radius curve, so you can get on the LOL pedal earlier onto a straight.

The opposite is early-apexing, which turns the driving line into a decreasing radius curve. This isn't really useful unless you have a straight onto a section of consecutive tight corners where you want to hold as much speed as you can before the first of the corners.

:thumbup:

i know exactly what he was talking about,
and under the right circumstances it can be a very useful tip.

the original poster asked about tips for the road,
and also asked if its ok to drive on the other side of the road.
i dont think telling someone that needs to ask that kind of question
to brake later is a good thing.

thats all.

[DX20VT]

If you are not a "late braker", why are you so hard on the brakes?

I can only interpret this as meaning that you brake hard, a long way before the entry point, then release the brake, select a lower gear, then coast in riding the clutch to get a smooth transition in drive - because you are not rev matching - then turning into the corner.

It doesn't need to be said, but minimising time spent off the brakes or off the throttle is a key way to improve lap times, among other tips mentioned. Therefore coasting while releasing the clutch slowly, instead of rev matching, takes additional time & is ultimately slower.



When I say I'm not a late braker, I know that I brake at a point on the track before the others do, but not by a long way, and if your on the brakes you should be on them hard as slowing down slowly is wasting time,
But I am usually well on the throttle at the apex of the corner again too,
as exit speed is more important than corner speed,

[distant00]

Go-karts...

[Chairs with flares]

Also, remember to leep looking up and through the corner instead of staring at the apex point on the ground. This leads to a smoother line as your focus changes less if you look at a distant point through the corner. It feels strange at first, but you get used to it and learn to know where the car is in the corner without having to look 'at' the corner.

Another technique I learn through motorcycling is target fixation. You will basically end up where you're looking, so instead of looking at that giant tree when you get squirelly, try and focus further down the road and your instinct will help you to save it...

[lo_rolla]

If your car feels like it's on rails your not going fast enough...

Or some thing, it was on the old forums some where.

[Redwarf]

Never cross the line on the road. Find a racetrack. Go back to the basics.

Do all you're braking in a straight line. (wherever possible) Brakes are your primary means of slowing down. Brakes are for slow, gears are for go. Heel and toe is nice, but can come later.

Have your gear selected by the time you're off the brakes. Come off the brakes and turn-in. Look through the corner. Don't accelerate until you're in the neighbourhood of the apex. Don't apply the accelerator until you know you're not going to get off it.

Smooth is the key. It's easier to start off slow and smooth, and become fast and smooth, than it is to try and iron out roughness. Most people get to a track and try to carry 10kph more through a corner than is possible. Physics don't change because you're on a race track. Slow in, fast out.

Get the basics right, and pace will follow soon.

[matt86]

Also, remember to leep looking up and through the corner instead of staring at the apex point on the ground. This leads to a smoother line as your focus changes less if you look at a distant point through the corner. It feels strange at first, but you get used to it and learn to know where the car is in the corner without having to look 'at' the corner.

Another technique I learn through motorcycling is target fixation. You will basically end up where you're looking, so instead of looking at that giant tree when you get squirelly, try and focus further down the road and your instinct will help you to save it...

GREAT ADVICE!!!!

your peripheral vision can look down, left and right BUT NOT UP!!! so look further through the corner and you will naturally pick the right line because you can view the whole corner!!!!!!

figuring this out on the mount cotton hill climb improved my times significantly!! i was staring at the visible road when i should have been looking through the trees to the exit of the corner..

[Rice86]

and who said initial D is fake and just a cartoon?..

[Chairs with flares]

and who said initial D is fake and just a cartoon?..


I'm probably going to get flamed for this, but the ' swirling/stirring a cup of water' trick improved the smoothness of my driving technique.

The jist of it (for anyone who hasn't watched it) is to put a cup of water in your car with the goal of not spilling any water; instead 'swirling' it around in the cup.

Breaking it down even more, it teaches you to limit your braking followed by a smooth turn-in then getting on the gas HARD as soon as possible after the apex.

The braking pushes the water to the front of the cup and turn-in pushes it to the side (Duh). But if you get the transition between these two actions smooth, the water will see it as one motion and followed by accelerating hard out of a turn; the water will move to the back of the cup. To truly 'stir' the water, you will need a section of S-curves with enough distance between to accelerate and brake between each corner.

Personally, this 'exercise' taught me to get on the LOL pedal as soon as possible and as hard as possible after the apex or the water would spill sideways with the increasing lateral G force.

-ALSO-

While Initial-D is [mostly] based around drifting, have a look at rally where drivers often 'pre-apex' slide a car into a corner. This is done not for show, but to point the car at the exit of the corner, letting them accelerate out of the corner sooner.

This is only useful on dirt/snow and other low traction surfaces; I hear you say. A low traction surface is just when the momentum of the car outweights the traction provided by the tires. This occurs at relatively low speed on gravel, but hte same effect happens at high speed on sticky asphalt; once the speed of the car is fast enough that the tires do not have enough traction to initiate a turn. The term for it is understeer and while it may happen on dirt at 30kph, the same thing happens on asphalt at a might higher speed, say 130kph.

So when you run out of traction because the speed/momentum, a normal grip technique no longer works as well because at that speed, you have essentially created a low traction environment; much like on dirt, but faster. As a result, low traction driving techniques start to work again.

Take this example. You are approaching a corner at speed. You turn in but the front tires don't bite, so you understeer to the outside of the corner. Assuming you back off the gas, the front tires may get grip (from the deceleration shifting weight to the front on putting more pressure on the turning tires.) and with the reduced rear grip from the weight shift, you have a nice oversteer situation. You got through the corner, but it was slow.
Alternatively, you take the same corner at the same speed, but instead of doing the whole under/oversteering thing at the apex, you do it earlier before the apex, right where the corner starts. As a result, by the time you're at the apex, you car is slightly sideways and pointed at the exit of the turn rather than parallel with the curve. At this point, since the car is pointed where you want to go, your tires can focus on 100% acceleration rather than using some available traction to turn.
This happens on a dirt road a relatively low speeds, but the same thing happens once you reach the grip threshold of the tires on any surface.

This is only hypothetical (infinite straight -> corner -> infinite straight), as some situations won't let you gain enough momentum to reach the grip threshold of the tires.


My $0.02, but what do I know, I learnt these techniques in a Prius...

[45KIDS]

*offtopic*: ^^ post up some pic's of you car man! i wanna see the thing everyone talks about :P

[Chairs with flares]

*offtopic*: ^^ post up some pic's of you car man! i wanna see the thing everyone talks about :P

http://www.ae86drivingclub.com.au/dcimages/1/1/6/7/13443.jpg

Driving a slow car fast is more fun than driving a fast car slow...

And living at the bottom of a windy hill while working at the top 6 nights a week helps too...

>@

[45KIDS]

that thing looks so aggresive! soo hot

[Konakid]

Nice write up jeff, to reach low level grip speeds on the road is fair scary but definately fast.

[all torque]

That Mazda (2?) is freakin' rad, man!

Any suspension mods?

[Water Boy]

Iv raced karts and more recently been doing tracks days.

There has been a lot of good advice on here and for newbies and any into cars take any advice on board.

Few things I try to tell knew people.

- Be smooth, its not fast when the tyres are screching ands youré off line.
- Slow in FAST out (Never fails)
- Learn to hell n toe left foor brake
- Try and follow others and see there lines etc.

BTW here is a good video of a "Good" driver in a slow powered car and "Not so good" driver in a fast car.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vhx3O1IZtwQ&eurl=http%3A%2F%2Fwww%2Erotorburn%2Ecom%2Fforums%2 Fshowthread%2Ephp%3Ft%3D47127%26highlight%3DCars%2 6page%3D51&feature=player_embedded

[Chairs with flares]

That Mazda (2?) is freakin' rad, man!

Any suspension mods?

Just 30mm lower springs, not too stiff.
Better offset wheels (+13 vs +45 stock) with semi-slicks
Flares are for a KE25 modded to fit
Custom canards and carbon diffuser that works (confirmed on the track)

Other than that it's a stock 1.5L auto...

:hehe:

[Water Boy]

Other than that it's a stock 1.5L auto...

Sorry did I just read correctly its an AUTO?

Dude arnt you like the master of Grip in SA?

[racsov]

lol auto 2s are so incredibly slow for a modern car. if you can cain the hills in that you must be like a hill climbing jesus.

interesting advice in this thread. what ill contribute is that on the street NEVER drive more than 8-10s, dont push that little bit harder, if your at your/your tyres limit back off.. ive learnt this first hand in the form of a gravly apex and a rock wall.

[Chairs with flares]

lol auto 2s are so incredibly slow for a modern car.

Yes; yes they are...:girl:

BUT they are fast compared to a Prius; which was what I learnt in. Once the battery is drained, it's 50kw driving a 1400kg car. You learn a lot about keeping momentum through turns...


:hehe:

[MINIHORSE]

practice makes perfect, learn to drive a slow car fast and you will have no problems

[Konakid]

slow cars with shit suspension teaches you soooooooo much, my weapon of choice was an auto volvo 240.

[all torque]

+1 about honing your skills in a slow car. I used to drive an FSM Niki to work every day (through the hills.) That was also a real momentum car. Once I got back behind the wheel of a 'proper' car, I found myself much more confident.

[MINIHORSE]

auto 2.0 mitsu sigma, with a hole in the exhaust manifold the size of a small 3rd world country, i loved the day i kept up with a diablo, testarossa and an e46 m3 down greenhill rd

[Dave]

Sorry did I just read correctly its an AUTO?

Dude arnt you like the master of Grip in SA?

+1 jeff why auto? are you too lazy to shift gears or something :hehe:

[bigdaddykane]

slow cars with shit suspension teaches you soooooooo much, my weapon of choice was an auto volvo 240

auto 93 magna with a stuffed gearbox tougay beast

[Chairs with flares]

+1 jeff why auto? are you too lazy to shift gears or something :hehe:

Need one hand to hold my cup of green tea, damn cupholders are too big...

:shout:

[Joel-AE86]

downhillz 4TW.

Extra inertia is as good as power on the downhill.

[James86]

lots of good info in here........all of which you'll forget when your actually driving.

imo only way you'll improve is by going out and doing it. I have done two of the john bowe high performance drive days at mallala which are really good because you have an instructor go passenger with you and show you what line, turn in points etc whilst actually doing it.

Its an expensivev track day but weith the ammount of track time you get and how much you learn its kind of worth it even just as a once off. Check them out on the john bowe website.

[Jase86]

If your in Vic - the WRX club run some really good track days and if you havent raced before you get put into "Driver Training" class where you get teamed with one of the more experienced members to sit in the passenger seat and show you the ropes(ie. race lines, braking points and general tips etc.) until your ready to go it on your own - no extra cost over the normal fee for the day. The guys are all pretty cool and friendly. You learn so much quicker with an experienced guy in the seat next you.

[Chairs with flares]

lots of good info in here........all of which you'll forget when your actually driving.


+1 If you even need to try to remember it, it's not instinctive, like it should be.

It's just practise until it becomes second nature without even have to think about it.

And the John Bowe track schools are good too; worth the extra for the tuition on top of a track day.

[Water Boy]

If your in Vic - the WRX club run some really good track days and if you havent raced before you get put into "Driver Training" class where you get teamed with one of the more experienced members to sit in the passenger seat and show you the ropes(ie. race lines, braking points and general tips etc.) until your ready to go it on your own - no extra cost over the normal fee for the day. The guys are all pretty cool and friendly. You learn so much quicker with an experienced guy in the seat next you.

PIARC and many others clubs do this too and is a super fun day!

Next driving training day at Phillip Island is May 30th...

[obey wan boenny]

Lot of good tips but all comes from practice, most should all come naturally from practice and not have to over think it.
Driving slow cars fast FTW :) Learnt and still drive a completely standard gemini through hills, fun :)

Jeffery the downhill technician :D best hills run was ages back, my first time riding with him in the prius, down a certain windy rd that looked out onto the city during lightening storm. twas fun/scary/arousing.

benny.

[MINIHORSE]

i was whithin the fridge of doom on that particular night, as we decended the lofted mountain, to aquire some refreshing carbonated beverages from memory, those were indeed the days

[driftke70]

1.3 suzi sierra was my slow learner, they actually handle pretty well aside from the free play in the wheel, plus with 31's gutters become ripple strips

[fantapants]

hell yeah on the suzi....
had one with a twin cam conversion. driftin wasnt the easiest but was great fun and u had to be real gentle and progressve on direction changes :)

it is apparently still terrorizing the bush and beachs of victoria, im pretty sure the current owner is on here :)

[driftke70]

http://img88.imageshack.us/img88/1460/image0459gx.jpg

[letsgohunting]

slow cars with shit suspension teaches you soooooooo much, my weapon of choice was an auto volvo 240.

I agree 100% - over the last 5 years I've practiced my driving starting with a string of ae86s both 4age and 4ac, a stagea, an accord wagon and a mazda 3.

The mazda 3 in particular was a bit of a weapon - As a factory car the amount of hussle you can muster through a string of corners is pretty fearsome. Driving all sorts of platforms (rwd, awd, fwd, hatchbacks, 4 door sedans, wagons) has really had the most impact on my driving, as well as learning how to drive a fwd quickly and efficiently. The whole FWD cars suck thing is really a load of crap - I'd be happy to take a nicely setup mazda 3 or honda civic over most of the cars on this site or even secret drift if I was looking for the best time on a hillrun.

[driftke70]

hehe,

its simmilar to me with the hilux, i went through a set of commercial tyres in 30 thou, and not just wearing rears and putting them on the front, i had to put the good backs because the front were fucked. i learnt to drive my hilux faster than i could in my rolla, thats when i sorta decided to go 3s, it has pretty stiff suspension that comes alive when your really cooking, and can get some really nice floaty entries into corners and stuff, but open center is poo.

[thu187]

hi Guys.

i am using your software for tracking. and it is realy cool software.

i am interesting about last pages of visitors. i need to know from what page visitor leave my site.

is there some way for tracking or may be you can help me to constract direct query to DB.

thank you

This is why you shouldn't do drugs.

[Chairs with flares]

hi Guys.

i am using your software for tracking. and it is realy cool software.

i am interesting about last pages of visitors. i need to know from what page visitor leave my site.

is there some way for tracking or may be you can help me to constract direct query to DB.

thank you

http://www.ae86drivingclub.com.au/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=4356&stc=1&d=1245481616

[mack 10]

Press the middle pedal less and the right one more. Works for me

[Chairs with flares]

Press the middle pedal less and the right one more. Works for me

Unless the right pedal is maxed out; in which case 'pulse' the left pedal...

:hehe::gah:

[James86]

jeff, in your case how does that help?:yeah:

[MINIHORSE]

lob!!

[mack 10]

Left foot brakeing... duhh

[Chairs with flares]

jeff, in your case how does that help?


Left foot brakeing... duhh

Man-LSD to get power down coming out of corners...
Technique works well with Man-BS (Man braking system) and Man-Steering (MANual steering with an auto rack and pump still hooked up but not functional)

Makes for a mantastic driving experience.

:shocked:

[James86]

wait.......so how many men are driving?

[Chairs with flares]

wait.......so how many men are driving?

As many as there needs to be. Unless they're Asian men; then you can replace all but one with calculators...

>.<