Page 3 of 12 FirstFirst 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 LastLast
Results 21 to 30 of 120

Thread: The Suspension Setup Thread

  1. #21
    Senior Member sr_rolla's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Name
    beau
    State
    NSW
    Location
    Bathurst
    Country
    Australia
    Posts
    435

    Default

    (quote old thread kaibeecee)

    i think you're not factoring in the diff-centre weight itself, shafts, stub-axles and the other ancilliaries involved, it turns out to weigh alot more than a live axle setup

  2. #22
    Senior Member sr_rolla's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Name
    beau
    State
    NSW
    Location
    Bathurst
    Country
    Australia
    Posts
    435

    Default

    (quote old thread highlife)

    IRS rear end has much more adjustability than a live axle setup - and also much less unsprung weight - so yeah there will be advantages, wether or not its worth the hassle/$$ is up to you.

  3. #23
    Senior Member sr_rolla's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Name
    beau
    State
    NSW
    Location
    Bathurst
    Country
    Australia
    Posts
    435

    Default

    a guy that used to be on here, improvedae86, did just what your talking about. The main thing to factor in is to make a heap of measurements, if its to wide, the car will understeer and if u end up getting toe change on suspension compression then it will be horrible to drive and then you have 2 factor in the camber changes aswell. What r u using the car for? do u want it to turn or do you want a drag car? Whilst having less unsprung weight is good, having correct geometry is better. I personally would run an equal length 4 link setup with a live diff and maybe a watts linkage setup.

    In laymans terms, i'd rather have a rear end setup that works properly and is a little heavy than a trick light weight IRS setup that doesnt do what its told

  4. #24
    Senior Member sr_rolla's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Name
    beau
    State
    NSW
    Location
    Bathurst
    Country
    Australia
    Posts
    435

    Default

    (quote old thread gunner)

    Thanks guys, sr rolla the car will be used primarily for grip work, what do you mean if it is too wide it will want to understeer, as in its width in relation to a narrow front end, the front is gettin a fair wack of extra track.

    I understand that if it isn't done correctly it will be worse that a standard car, I've learnt just how bad things can go on a drag car when the geometry changes under compression, I could only imagine what would happen mid corner and for somethin to go out out of wack.

    At the moment it is just an idea, as the equal 4 link, and watts link are the way i was intending to go, though since i have access to a complete rear subframe, and since the rear floor is gettin chopped up, i think it would be good to weigh up the options available involving rear irs.

    thanks guys great help

    Cheers
    Rhys

  5. #25
    Senior Member sr_rolla's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Name
    beau
    State
    NSW
    Location
    Bathurst
    Country
    Australia
    Posts
    435

    Default

    (quote old thread gunner)

    Ok suspension gods I have another question, I have complete S14 struts, control arms, etc (I have recently finished a big upgrade on an s14 for InTheRed tuning)
    now i haven't done any real measurement as yet, but i would like to know, whats going to be the limiting factor in fitting these, the only real issue i can see is that i will have to dick around with strut tower mounts (bring them further out, it is roughly 100mm either side) or is it more complex than that, sorry to be a noob, but I'm only learnin suspension i know how to go fast, just not how to turn lol.

  6. #26
    Senior Member sr_rolla's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Name
    beau
    State
    NSW
    Location
    Bathurst
    Country
    Australia
    Posts
    435

    Default

    personally, i would stick with the toyota setup and improve on it, basically the only problems with the front end in a ae/ke is the castor rod arangement and the balljoint location. If u could move the balljoint closer to the disc (ie outward) u will improve the scrub radius properties and it will be nicer to drive with fatter, dished wheels. I don't like the S13/14 setup on a KE/AE, the balljoint angles are wrong, all the mounts are in the wrong place, its just a pain in the arse (altho plenty of people here will argue my point no doubt). There is also a whole heap of other variables that come into it that make things difficult. Ackeman effects, scrub radius changes, angles changes between the LCA and tie rod, the rate at which these changes happen as the suspension moves, etc.

    If u really want to run silvia stuff, the only way to do it properly is to measure across the strut tops and from balljoint to balljoint at the bottom when everything is mounted in a stock silvia, then measure the balljoint-balljoint when the silvia lower arms are in the ke/ae, then take that difference and take/add that amount to the silvia strut top measurment and go from there. Also bare in mind that with this setup, if u want it to work right u will need to lose the deep dish front wheels.

  7. #27
    Senior Member sr_rolla's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Name
    beau
    State
    NSW
    Location
    Bathurst
    Country
    Australia
    Posts
    435

    Default

    (quote old thread gunner)

    Well the idea, was to mod the strut towers, and what ever else, to bring the angles closer to that of an s14, I know that if any of the angles, or distances are balls up, it won't work. And i don't like the idea of bolting in s13 stuff, it can't be better than quality stuff built for an 86, and I'm not after camber, just track, and the ease of findin big brakes

  8. #28
    Senior Member sr_rolla's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Name
    beau
    State
    NSW
    Location
    Bathurst
    Country
    Australia
    Posts
    435

    Default

    Why do you want to increase track? AE86's have a near on perfect width to length ratio to start with. If you are deadset on increasing track, I would probably use wheel offsets to achieve what your after and use more of a standard derived setup on the suspension. With the brakes i wold just be chasing a strut with a larger diameter stub axle so that you can run larger wheels (width and dia.) without flex. For brakes, theres plenty available, theres the hilux pug/setup, the mini/rx7 setup through AJPS and it wouldn't be overly difficult to get any caliper disc setup you want, just get a caliper adapter machined up and work off a disc that will bolt to a standard hub or machine your own hubs up. If you could fit a big enough wheel you could even adapt a porsche setup to a sprinter/corona/celica strut.

    Also, the pug/hilux setup is awesome, i have it and according to the engineer who tested it, it has similar stopping power to a porsche and NEVER gets fade. I only ever got fade once and it was coming down from 180kp/h to 60kp/h and it got a tad spongy, i had full brake by the next corner tho. I don't have braided line, i have standard hilux pads, standard shitty rotors and celica drum rears so i can improve on that aswell.

  9. #29
    Senior Member sr_rolla's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Name
    beau
    State
    NSW
    Location
    Bathurst
    Country
    Australia
    Posts
    435

    Default

    (quote old thread hatzo)

    First off a bit of history of the Ackerman angle concept..
    the concept was devised all the way back in the 1800's
    to keep carriage wheels from upsetting gravel driveways,

    In normal road situations ,
    it is wise to keep the pro Ackerman (dynamic toe out on turning) geometry ,
    due to the slow speed* (Low lateral (across car) loads) nature of driving on public roads.
    *depends on how much you want your license

    But as the lateral loads are increased with speed,
    there will be more drag placed on the inside front tyre than necessary
    so as the car is turning thru the radius of the turn.
    the car will understeer , as well as causing overheating of the tyre.

    The solution is to reduce the pro-Ackerman effect,
    and bring the steering geometry towards or to a parallel type arrangement.

    Thats about as simply as i can put it (its taken many rewrites + 1hour) ,

    One last bit .
    Tyres are the single most important factor ,
    on how a car performs.

  10. #30
    Senior Member sr_rolla's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Name
    beau
    State
    NSW
    Location
    Bathurst
    Country
    Australia
    Posts
    435

    Default

    agreed in part, ackerman is a little more complicated than that, it depends on the car individually. Different sidewall sizes front to rear, different offsets, tyre slip angles etc all play a part. Ackerman is hard to measure and hard to change without effecting other geometry, to be honest it is beyond most of the people on here to diagnose and change, we don't have access to the tools nessecary. Hence why i explained it but said not to change it.

    I do agree tho, tyres are the most important part of the suspension.

Page 3 of 12 FirstFirst 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 LastLast

Similar Threads

  1. (SA) *E7*/86 BC/AJPS Rear Suspension setup/ 2871r turbo setup
    By sleeper_13 in forum Car Parts For Sale
    Replies: 3
    Last Post: 25th July 2012, 01:06 AM
  2. Need Help With Suspension Setup
    By ArbPotatoes in forum Technical - Questions
    Replies: 22
    Last Post: 30th June 2009, 10:51 PM
  3. The Suspension Setup Thread
    By sr_rolla in forum Technical - Articles
    Replies: 84
    Last Post: 16th August 2008, 02:15 AM
  4. suspension setup
    By AE86_4life in forum Technical - Questions
    Replies: 9
    Last Post: 1st November 2006, 08:43 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •