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Thread: 20v 4age questions

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    Member Anthony13's Avatar
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    Default 20v 4age questions


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    Hei I no that most of what I'm about to ask would of been covered many times before but I'm going to ask again!

    I've nearly finish my 16v into ke70 a d I'm happy with it so far but I'm wanting to build a decent motor for it in the future and I've been going towards the 20v side of things I want to keep it all NA as I've already got an s14 to play with and like to have the option both turbo and NA now for the questions lol!

    I've done some reading on the silver top 20v and they say they have a better stronger bottom end than the black tops is this correct?
    And they also say that the black tips have a larger intake on them like 45mm? And a bigger intake cam lift?

    Now was wondering if you can put a black head onto a silver top bottom end and have the best of both? Can this be done if so what do you have to do to achieve this?

    How much power would this setup roughly make of it was kept fairly mild with new pistons cams and all the other bits?

    One last question will a 20v require different engine mounts or are they the same as 16v ones?

    I think that's most of what I was going to ask but just getting an idea of what I can and can't do!

    Thanks ( ^ ^ )/

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    Quote Originally Posted by Anthony13 View Post

    I've done some reading on the silver top 20v and they say they have a better stronger bottom end than the black tops is this correct?
    yes. thicker rods.

    And they also say that the black tips have a larger intake on them like 45mm?

    yes. the quads/ air box are larger.

    And a bigger intake cam lift?
    pretty sure the difference is 5 degrees on the exhaust cam, BT being the more aggressive of the two.

    Now was wondering if you can put a black head onto a silver top bottom end and have the best of both? Can this be done if so what do you have to do to achieve this?
    Yes. Swap one for the other. Consider going 7afe bottom, BT head. = 1800, as opposed to 1600.

    How much power would this setup roughly make of it was kept fairly mild with new pistons cams and all the other bits?
    pass.

    One last question will a 20v require different engine mounts or are they the same as 16v ones?
    pass. pretty sure they are the same.

    I think that's most of what I was going to ask but just getting an idea of what I can and can't do!

    Thanks ( ^ ^ )/

    Might want to add the purpose of the car- street? track? drift?

    Need to ask yourself - is it worth the mucking about? get a blacktop, achieve win? will you need more torque?

    further benefits:-
    - lighter flywheel (BT)
    - a better flowing head (BT)

    off the top of my head, thats all I can think of.

    I think Matt was compiling a list of differences between the two on here somewhere, might want to have a look for that thread.
    Last edited by Lurkin; 27th January 2013 at 02:37 PM.

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    Everyone bags the 4age blacktop 20v's out for being a weak bottom end because some genius pulled one apart and saw the rods where much thinner than the silvertop 20v. The only time a rod has failed in a blacktop that i've seen is due to a bearing failure. I've seen more silvertop 20v's with holes in the block than blacktops, possibly because of the price difference between the two 6-7 years ago was quite significant.

    When you think about a NA motor, a light weight bottom end makes allot more power. Effectively Toyota lightened the bottom end as much as they could with the blacktop and if Toyota were concerned they wouldn't have bumped the rev limit higher on the blacktop than the silvertop.

    So to answer your question, use the blacktop bottom end and head together. The mounts are 4a regardless of valves or head.

    Vvt also bumps up your torque.

    A stock blacktop on a aftermarket ecu / haltech etc will see around the 100kw atw stock.
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    Well I'm basicly after something that I can drive on the street and have that option to drift if so choose just a good all round car with a decient motor and power to go with it but not going over the top, thanks Matt that makes a lot of sense when you think about it like that

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    An aftermarket ECU is what you want, it will give you the low end punch you can use for keeping a drift going.

    If you wanted a lighter reciprocating and roating mass then Brian Crower rods are massively lighter than blacktop.

    Don't fall for the trap of bigger throttles is better, I have heard of two reports of increased power with silver throttles on a blacktop.

    Have you had a look through my website yet?

    also do you ever head to near Dandenong? I can show you every part and explain the difference.
    My website: SQ Engineering - 4AGE and 3SGE upgrade/replacement parts

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    I never skidded below 5000 in my 20v.

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    ok then, well a new tune is meant to give you about 15% in the top end extra
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    6spd ecu will also give you an increase over the 5 as well. Higher rev limit at 8400 as well
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    a 8400 limit on a stock blacktop? Interesting, where did you see/hear that one?
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    My cars I've owned, only with the 6spd ecu though
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