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Thread: 20v 4A-GE cranks but doesnt start.

  1. #1
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    Default 20v 4A-GE cranks but doesnt start.


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    As topic title says..

    Engine is freshly swapped and I have no prior 20v experience so nothing to relate to.

    Car is 1984 AE86 EDM Zenki Levin Coupè.

    Specs are:
    20v AE111 4AGE
    Stock engine
    Stock ignition (dizzy cap @ front #sq-engineering)
    ITG Air filter.

    I`ve connected yellow ECU 12v wire from Tweak`d harness to black-yellow on ignition so it gets switch power.
    Tried earthing ECU, checked all earths etc usual newb stuff, no dice

    Can feel fuel pump relay (Which I connected feed pump to) click once per crank revolution on starter when I hold the relay in my hand, it just goes click-click-click-click for every revolution on the crank so all is well there (20v ECU only sends power to fuel pump when crankshaft goes around)

    Tried running feed pump on separate circuit to build up a more constant flow of fuel but still no dice.

    Vid of how it all sounds like when i try to start (For those curious):
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8pn0oiPxseo

    Tried putting distributor @ around 10-15deg as per manual (Whole lot better than 0 deg anyway) but no go.
    Double checked all the usual stuff, harness plugs sits tight, connections are good, earths are scraped/polished and tight, 12v power @ terminal is all good, battery got enough juice and so forth, no cigar.

    I got no brake booster so large vac-outtakes front and back on the rail is plugged.
    EVAP not connected (Tweakdperformance said it wasnt needed so they didnt make a circuit for it) (So I got a hose from EVAP port on rail to charcoal canister)
    ISCV is connected, ISCV hoses are nice, tight and shut (And huge air filter for it too) and connector plug has all wires and pins/leads completely intact.
    Loosened MAP off its place and laid it so that MAP Vac-hose from between the ITB`s goes straight (To make sure vacuum flow was not interrupted)
    Still no party..

    Got my act together and checked the plugs, Plugs are dry and shiny clean, no gasoline smell from them.. Injectors not getting pulse from ECU and Coil not sending power to the distributor cap?

    Thanks in advance to any input
    Last edited by Tore; 7th May 2013 at 10:43 AM.

  • #2
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    A few questions...

    Is your ignitor bolted to the chassis, the actual earthing of these on the 20v is done through the casing. Do you have constant power to the ecu? As well as the ignition power? to the injectors + ignitor? I'll go in detail what to check where.

    Identify if it is a lack of spark issue, by removing a lead and seeing if you have it or fuel by (correct way fuel pressure gauge) or remove the return line briefly.
    Ae86 Drivingclub - Toyota AE86 Car Club where AE86 | KE70 | Toyota 86 / GT86 | Subaru BRZ | Scion FRS owners

  • #3
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    Hi Matt!

    Thanks for input

    Ignitor is not bolted to chassis (Cant get bracket bolt holes lined up with anywhere on chassis and no working drill, my Dremel is RIP too) but theres a earth wire @ the bracket, I connected that to chassis and ziptied the bracket to battery plate (Battery is moved to back of car)
    ECU 12v switched power is connected to Black-Yellow at the ignition switch and constant power is connected @ 12v + Terminal as per Dr.Tweak`s instructions (I`m using harness from them, but their customer care is really slow and dont answer most of my questions, so thats frustrating..)
    When I used switched circuit for fuel pump I had fuel in return line but now with fuel pump connected to Engine harness FP-relay, the relay engages on/off ronski-speed so fast the pump, from what I hear, cant engage! because relay rides on engine crankshaft revolution I think fuel pressure is rather low!!

    Have got a 15YO timing light but obviously cant operate that while starting the car from inside and no-one to help out in person, Old man`s overseas, bro`s busy til 6 then gets called by just about anyone and asked for help with anything from swatting a fly to fixing a computer (Which is usually the person forgetting to plug the wire in), the rest are friends who says they can help if they get to drive the car (The kind of friends who go through cars more often than chewing gum, you know the type.. I wouldnt entrust them with a lawn mower...)

    I have got no fancy leds (Xcept from a trashed flashlight) I got no access to high tech hardware to assemble anything of the sort that the pro`s use (Like resistors and stuff, got a bunch of dead TV`s to grab stuff like that from but thats it) and I live in desolate outskirts of Nowhereton and I`m utterly out of cash and cant buy anything, blew this month`s money hoping for a running engine and just when I needed the Toyota legend to come true to give me a engine that runs it goes about-face and decides to throw all the crap @ me and show absolutely no mercy..


    I DO have a spare ignitor/coil/ECU-noise assembly though but even if replaced fuel should still get to the chamber? Plugs are still dry..

    Sry for frustrating tone in my reply, by no means am I trying to be nasty here! I appreciate and am thankfull to all input
    Took a few days break from the whole ordeal to recuperate but doesnt seem to be helping..
    Last edited by Tore; 7th May 2013 at 12:41 PM.

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    Bolt the ignitor to one hole on the chassis that'll be enough... And temporarily run the fuel pump constantly.

    I get how frustrating it is, so close yet so far.
    Ae86 Drivingclub - Toyota AE86 Car Club where AE86 | KE70 | Toyota 86 / GT86 | Subaru BRZ | Scion FRS owners

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    do you have the fuel lines on backwards just a quick check because 20v and 16v are opposite haha i have seen a few people fuck that one up
    the dyno pull to 300rwkw

    BT20v is making 300rwkw like i said i would without nitrous so now its time for some spray and see if she will run a 10s or less

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    Fuel lines are on correctly (In- at back of engine, out at fuel pressure regulator) But thx for the heads up
    Also, Pen, your BT20v seems to be working really well! Good work with limited parts! (I.e not going all-out)
    Though I understand the plan was also to install TRD crank but still, with the parts on it right now those are exactly the kind of numbers you`re supposed to get!
    You got one scary-ass mapper there!!

    Injectors check out (not below 3 ohms).
    Matt, I bolted coil to chassis, still no go.. But still good to have it bolted down so thanks for giving me the incentive to go ahead and bolt it down anyway!
    Last edited by Tore; 8th May 2013 at 05:17 AM.

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    I figured out the connection! (lol)

    Turned out to be bad ECU earth, was discussing the problem @ the aeu86 forums when someone mentioned ECU earth for what I think was umphteenth time.
    From there it went "yeah but its connected at the engine valve cover, what more co... owh.. shait.."
    Valve cover is separated from engine head by metal gasket all the way around..

    Started up after a couple of tries

    Now to fix bad timing as it snorks when I apply throttle, so I guess pull it anti clockwise a little more?
    And sort out a small water leak (Shitty vendor Volvo radiator has a small water outlet for some reason)

    Thx a lot for the help and hints

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    Glad you got it sorted...
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  • #9
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    Couldnt of been done without cool heads and generations of experience on forums, I`m glad you took your time to answer my plead for help

    Now I`m having #1 ITB backfire @ startup`s and very boggy revs (Went get past what sounds like 1500-2000rpm), pretty sure there are no vacuum leaks, MAP sensor gets 5 volts and so forth.
    Will sort some fuel pipes tommorow, I`m hoping the bogging and the backfire might be because FPR is compensating with too much fuel pressure for return hose leaking a little bit (Enough to wet finger but no dripping), leak is in luggage compartment because of that hard bend there..
    Last edited by Tore; 8th May 2013 at 12:48 PM.

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    Is your alternator charging? < 14v the 20v will bog down and struggle to rev.
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