View Full Version : 4age cam degree
&Drew
29th October 2011, 05:52 PM
hi everyone!
Just wanted to know which cams were better for my cars' set-up before i put the engine in. i want to keep the stock lift (i think 7.9mm for Toyota 4age) and not change the springs/valves and what not. Really new to the whole mechanical side to cars & was sorta lost. im stuck between choosing either 256 or 272 degree cams. i dont know which would suit my car. It will most likely run with ITB's, 4-1 extractors, custom exhaust, aftermarket ecu and possibly adj cam gears. just wanted to know any pros and cons of both and whether having different degree cams for the in & ex will do help? ive been on all the toyota forums i know and looked for days & asked Q's as well to no avail *sighh.
any help would be much appreciated.
Cheers guys & gals
Jimmee1990
29th October 2011, 06:02 PM
I don't see why you would want to run ITB's and 4-1's which are suited to a higher rpm range, but run cams with a small amount of lift with stock springs? Just seems a little counter-productive to me. I would have thought cams on the milder side would work far better with 4-2-1's to help in the midrange and a standard inlet manifold would be fine, cheaper too. It all depends on what you want to get out of the engine?
FoldKing86
29th October 2011, 06:34 PM
Save your monies and do it right the first time :thumbup:
&Drew
29th October 2011, 11:48 PM
oh yeah, im really noob at these sorta stuff but am learning haha. the parts i got were mapart of a package off a mate. if so, what degree cams would you guys reccomend? does that mean i need a shim kit?
hahah yeah trying to do it right the firsat time is the best solution :(
&Drew
30th October 2011, 12:04 AM
should i just buy a 4-2-1 extractor with mild camshafts & an upgrading up-lifter kit? will still run th itbs since i already have it as opposed to rwd inlet manifold.
cheers guys
Slimer86
30th October 2011, 05:13 PM
8.1mm 264 HKS cam's are pretty mild, yet with increased compression respond well with quads and (esp.)aftermarket ecu etc.
Set cam timing as per the HKS cam card which comes with them, else search Oldschooltoy on club4ag as he has uploaded them previously.
I wouldn't personally go with any less than 264, its just too little an "upgrade" from stock. Really only benefit coming from increase in lift.
FYI, i am running 264, 256 8.1mm HKS in my daily and its very driveable, with a noticeable torque increase, but probably too conservative for my liking.
>8.3mm lift it is suggested to go under-bucket shims, but else, if you choose cams below this lift, just upgrade the valve springs to toda's, HKS or TRD's when you put the cams in.
McLEVIN
30th October 2011, 06:54 PM
Is the valve springs necessary I got hks Cams and I don't think the springs would've been upgraded
&Drew
30th October 2011, 10:55 PM
slimer86 - cool, that helped heaps mate!! i was going to go for a 264 IN, 272 EX or vice versa. wondering if thats too much? Also would it be best to use all hks parts or if i interchange with tomei, toda and hks would that be fine as well?
ive got a mate who can supply me with some cheap upgraded hks springs and toda camshafts
&Drew
30th October 2011, 11:05 PM
mcLevin - what cams are you running?
McLEVIN
31st October 2011, 12:14 AM
I was told 264 lol
&Drew
31st October 2011, 11:48 AM
oh yeah, i think 264 is the max you can go with standard internals. i wanted to go a bit higher but theres so many varying opinions out there. just wanted to see what people have and yeah, work from there
TODA AU
31st October 2011, 03:20 PM
This may help...
http://www.ae86drivingclub.com.au/dcimages/7/5/7/5/249466.jpg
marvis
31st October 2011, 10:10 PM
I would go 27x or 28x with higher lift for NA engine.
&Drew
31st October 2011, 11:21 PM
If i go anything higher than 272 would i have to purchase an inner shim kit? or would up-rated springs do the job? hahah man im sucha noob
TODA AU
1st November 2011, 01:14 PM
If i go anything higher than 272 would i have to purchase an inner shim kit? or would up-rated springs do the job? hahah man im sucha noob
Duration is not as much of an issue as valve lift with OEM outer shims.
TODA recommend using their inner shim kit for lift values of 8.75mm & over.
(Other manufacturers say otherwise & run to higher limits with the OEM outer shim)
That said, the aggresivness of the cam ramps also plays a part in the ability of a certain cam to use outer shims or require inner shims.
Good aggressive ramp rate cams make good power, but the extra lift can flick the outer shim from the top of the bucket at high rpm.
The fix is to use an inner shim kit or use less aggressive cams wherebye you can run more lift & duration & keep the OEM outer shim.
The trade off with the latter is a little less power for a given profile (lift/duration) & poorer drivability.
(ie: Tight lash [high lift shorter duration] cams make more power)
The issue is really a financial one as there is a significant cost differnce between the two systems.
Higher lift will make more power, or the match the peak power of a longer duration lower lift cam & deliver better idle, drivability & midrange power.
For std bottom end, it's hard to go past the 264/256 combo. (running as much lift as you can afford too)
You can make more power going bigger but with trade offs in drivability & idle quality.
FoldKing86
1st November 2011, 01:18 PM
ive got a mate who can supply me with some cheap upgraded hks springs and toda camshafts
Hooks up oh yeah
20v Part Num: 14111-101-022 (272 9.0) quote please
TODA AU
1st November 2011, 01:45 PM
Hooks up oh yeah
20v Part Num: 14111-101-022 (272 9.0) quote please
Just so you know, 14111-101-022 has been superseeded by 14111-101-023 (272 9.2)
You can still get 14111-101-022 but it'd be back-order.
14111-101-023 is $605 delivered
If you get a better price, let me know & I'll see what I can do to beat it for you.
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