Is my EFI Diagram adequate?

[luke86]

Well Im up to the stage where I need to do the EFI system and I've spent all day studying on it and have come up with this.

Now the reason Im going in this direction and not using the JDM one is that when I got the donor car the tank was in pieces and Im not too keen on using it in the condition that its in. It may be up for sale soonish.

Also note that Im in the process of installing the JDM lines so that means *i think* 6mm feed/return and 4mm breather lines will be installed?

I'll be using EFI high pressure hoses and clamps,VL External Fuel Pump and smallish Filter with a VL/VK Lifter pump.

http://www.ae86drivingclub.com.au/dcimages/1/1/7/15513.jpg

Can anyone see any flaws or can input on any thing I've missed out on?

Cheers
Luke

[Jonny Rochester]

With the standard 4A-C setup:
The main fuel line is 6.3mm.
The return is 4mm.
The vapour line is 6.3mm.

Standard 4A-GE setup:
Main fuel line is 8mm
Return is 6.3mm, I think.

You can switch the use of the lines over, to have 6.3mm return.

Many people will tell you to use a surge tank also. You don't have to, see how you go. Depends on the placement of the in-tank pump.

[luke86]

Depends on the placement of the in-tank pump.

So do you mean installing the lifter right on the bottom of the tank?

[Jonny Rochester]

The EFI tank has a bucket surrounding the pump intake. If you have a ADM tank, you would think about using a surge tank. And at the very least, you want the pump intake mounted as low as possible without touching the bottom.

[luke86]

I had a look inside the JDM tank and I can see the 'bucket' surrounding the pump and so that has the same purpose as a surge tank but was built in factory. Correct?

[Jip86]

I had a look inside the JDM tank and I can see the 'bucket' surrounding the pump and so that has the same purpose as a surge tank but was built in factory. Correct?

yup. :thumbup:

[Hen may possibly be a nut]

I love your diagram. Bloody neat for hand drawn.

Your setup will work. However I don't see too much point of using two pumps and no surge tank (though some cars did come with a factory setup like this).

If you aren't running a surge tank, I'd just drop an in tank EFI pump in (JDM AE86, AE82, S13, there are plenty of options) and delete the first fuel filter and high pressure external pump.

If you did run a surge tank, it'd go in between the first filter and the high pressure external pump.

Hen

[luke86]

Haha well Im left handed and Apples don't have MS-Paint to sketch up a mad drawing.

So If I got a stronger IN-TANK pump then I wouldn't have to run the EXTERNAL and FILTER after the tank, is that right?

[Hen may possibly be a nut]

Correct. You just need a high pressure in tank pump (from an EFI car, there are heaps of options). And you can ditch the first filter, but of course you need an EFI filter before the fuel rail. Also note that there is a difference between normal plastic fuel filters and metal EFI filters, I'll let you guess which to use in the high pressure line.

Hen

[Jonny Rochester]

Haha well Im left handed and Apples don't have MS-Paint to sketch up a mad drawing.



My Apple had MacPaint in 1993.

[Golberg]

I couldn't see it mentioned here. Even if the JDM tank is rubbish, why not use the tank bracket in the ADM tank? Or was that what you were planning on doing? Just do that and grab an EFI in tank pump out of just about any Toyota.

What is actually wrong with your JDM tank anyway? My one was rusty as all hell inside when I got it. But there are special refurb kits you can buy which strip all the rust out, seal the bare metal and fill any pin holes. So I used one of those on my tank and it came out great.

[luke86]

I was thinking of doing this but isn't the ADM tank bracket the same as the JDM one? Im not too sure but I assume it would be very similar.

The tank is hell rusty really and I didn't know that there was refurb kits available but a quick search came up with this.

Radiator shops 'boil out' fuel tanks to get rid of all the gunk so surely that means the rust would go too? After this process the tank should be sealed.

Has anyone had any experience with that (boiling out/sealing)? How much does it cost?

[Golberg]

Look at POR15 or KBS coatings kits, they're specifically called "fuel tank repair" kits.

I used the KBS one as it was cheaper and from the reviews I read its was a little better too. But they're basically the same thing.

As with the bracket, I actually meant, "pump bracket" and yes they are very different between ADM and JDM. The ADM one doesn't have the 8mm main line either, doesn't have the threaded attachment for the fuel line also. JDM pump bracket does however fit into the ADM tank fine though. But I'd say to you to seriously look into the tank repair kit, almost all JDM tanks are rusty as hell when they come here anyway, this is because its not uncommon (or atleast it wasn't) for Japanese fuel stations to mix water with the petrol as such the insides of the tanks rust.

There is a thread somewhere on Toymods with somebody who refurbed a JDM tank (I think it was a rides thread, a fairly old one, although not update all that long ago). But the tank they started with was awful, had been out in the rain for a while too.

[Jase86]

I bodged up my own intank pump bracket for my ADM tank.

http://www.ae86drivingclub.com.au/dcimages/1/5/3/9/15899.jpg

[davew]

sorry to revive an old thread here guys, bt i'm reading lots of conflicting stories on in-tank pumps... if i follow the above diagram but without the surge tank and second filter, i can just use an in-tank efi pump is that correct? does anyone have any suggestions for what sort of in-tank pumps i can use? If i tear the cradle and in-tank pump out of a standard vl and use that is that all i need? or do i need a second pump like this article suggests?
http://www.rollaclub.com/faq/index.php?title=Tech:Engine/A_Series/Installing_EFI_Lifter_Pump_into_AE86_Fuel_Tank


cheers any help before sunday would be awesome!!

[Nikkojoe]

The VL pre-pumps are just that, they are used before the main external high pressure pump. You are best off getting an ae82 4age intank pump/cradle because its a high pressure in-tank pump. It also bolts in, but you need to extend it to sit at bottom of tank.

[davew]

ok cheers, but presuming i can't find an ae82 to butcher/steal the cradle from, what are my other options for cars with suitable pumps?

[Nikkojoe]

I think camry of the same era, as with many other toyota's of the same era. I'm sure you could find the cradle easily :)

[davew]

ok. i really should have clarified here sorry. i'm doing this in an ae71. after going to the wreckers and tearing out an ae82 4ag pump and cradle i returned home and found it is too big to even fit the pump in the tank. so my options are find a smaller in-tank pump? (any suggestions??) or take an ae86 tank which i am looking at buying and modifying it to fit an ae71. i hear this is not all that uncommon. who here has done this? what's involved in making the 86 tank fit the 71?

[Nikkojoe]

The ae82 pump and cradle fits in an ae86 tank, as its of the same era. Dont waste time with e7 tanks unless you just run an external pump :)

To fit the ae86 tank, you need to get your e7 filler neck and cut/fit to the ae86 one. From memory the ae86 neck is clamped down with a rubber hose at the base, where as e7 is welded? The e7 i think also has an external breather hose which you probably will just block off.