4g63 into ke70

[provan]

hey im planning on putting a 4g63 non turbo out of a 89'' galant

was wondering if anyone has heard of this being done nd what would be needed

cheers

chris

[shift_rook]

lol, why bother? sr has been done and proven and already comes in rwd. don't know exact specifincs but even if you do hasve a 4g63 just sittin there, it'd probably be cheaper to just go n/a sr

[kaibeecee]

fuck that, i'd rather have a (late model) 4G63 if i could over an SR anyday.

great motor (albeit balance shafts when aiming for high power) and way more reliable than an SR.

i think you need a starion (G63B?) bellhousing or something. not sure what box you'd use either.

[MJ86]

You should be able to adapt the motor up to the t-50 or a celica steel case or whatever you want really and it does not have to cost a fortune.

[af300e]

If you are going to bother converting a motor from transaxle to longitudinal configuration, why not keep it in the family and use a 3sge/gte?

[rthy]

does the starion gbox bolt into the 4g63?

if u do all the work ur self it should be interesting.

[banzai_pots]

cant u bolt the 4g63 upto a sigma gbox?

[Jonny Rochester]

I have done a full conversion before, 4G63T into an Express van. Was able to use a van gearbox and engine mounts etc and it all bolted up (after finding the parts).

Getting info off the forumz for mitsubishi stuff is a little harder than with Toyota stuff. Because the Mitsubishi performance "community" is smaller and more capable of talking total BS.

You can use a FWD engine, and bolt a RWD gearbox on from a Starian. But there are basically 2 sizes/styles of flywheel and belhousing bolts. You have to measure the distance between the 2 main lower bolt holes to know the difference, and the diameter of the flywheel. Either big or little flywheel. And wide or narrow bolt spacing on the engine/gearbox. No good info on which is what, just have the measure and see. Also a difference between 7 and 6 bolts on the crank/flywheel. Also cable vs hydralic clutch. But you can find the right gearbox if you keep looking.

KE70 = custom tailshaft and mounts.

RWD = modifyed intake manifold and a few other little things.

[44GTE]

Hey Jonny


I would be very interested if you have any more info regarding this as i am looking at bringing in 4G63 engines and am thinking about wether or not to fit one into my 86.

When you talk starion gearbox you mean the turbo version ? and do you know off hand a chasis prefix for a starion so as i can try and track down a gearbox etc.

cheers

[yoshimitsu9]

fuck that, i'd rather have a (late model) 4G63 if i could over an SR anyday.

great motor (albeit balance shafts when aiming for high power) and way more reliable than an SR.

i think you need a starion (G63B?) bellhousing or something. not sure what box you'd use either.

x2 4g63 > sr20

[provan]

hey

im doing a 4g63 cos i took it outta my old galant after it was torched earlier this year
me nd my brother r gonna do it at the start of next yr cos t the moment im in the army nd dont have the time nd no where to have a car
just workin on gettin a chassis at the moment nd parts
eg suspension brakes mounts nd a new loom ats the one out my car was slightly melted in the fire.

i kno a sigma box bolts up to a 4g63 easily with out too much work
the only thing im worried about mainly is the drive shaft exhaust nd the wiring

[44GTE]

hey

im doing a 4g63 cos i took it outta my old galant after it was torched earlier this year
me nd my brother r gonna do it at the start of next yr cos t the moment im in the army nd dont have the time nd no where to have a car
just workin on gettin a chassis at the moment nd parts
eg suspension brakes mounts nd a new loom ats the one out my car was slightly melted in the fire.

i kno a sigma box bolts up to a 4g63 easily with out too much work
the only thing im worried about mainly is the drive shaft exhaust nd the wiring


Hi

What version 4g63 are you using ? Evo 4 / 5 /6 /7 ??

Do you reckon the sigma box will handle 200kw at the flywheel ??

cheers

[driftke70]

custom mani, new tail shaft, and just run after market ecu

[rthy]

Hi

What version 4g63 are you using ? Evo 4 / 5 /6 /7 ??

Do you reckon the sigma box will handle 200kw at the flywheel ??

cheers

looks like he is running the NA 4g63 version from the Galant

OT: how about those turbo sigma gbox behing the evo1-3 gbox?

[provan]

yea its a non turbo 4g63 out of a hg gsr galant

from what i hear its a gc sigma box that fits or starion box

i have a friend who drives a sigma nd he reckons sigma boxes arnt tht strong so i doubt theyd put up with 200kw for long
unless u baby the fuck outta of it

[sun_moon]

DOHC or SOHC ??


[edit] 4G63
The 4G63 was a 1997 cc version. (85 mm Bore x 88 mm Stroke) SOHC and DOHC were produced. The DOHC version was introduced in 1987 in the Japanese market Galant VR-4 and came turbocharged or naturally aspirated. It is found in various models including the 1988-92 Galant VR-4 and the U.S. market 1990-1999 Eclipse, as well as the Mitsubishi Lancer Evolution I-IX.

The SOHC version was used in Mitsubishi Galant models until 1993. It has 76 kW of output and 157 NM of torque at 4750 rpm.

Also the SOHC version is produced until the late 90s and early 2000 and it is used in Mitsubishi cars like the Montero and the 2.0L 2-door Pajero with an output of 101kW at 4700 rpm. Also the N33 and N83 Spacewagon(UK market) in single cam 16 valve format.

The Mitsubishi Eclipse, Eagle Talon and Plymouth Laser introduced the DOHC turbocharged intercooled version to the U.S. in 1989 through Diamond Star Motors, a joint venture between Mitsubishi Motors and the Chrysler Corporation. From 1990 to late April 1992 came beefier rods and the use of 6 bolts to secure the flywheel to the crankshaft; May 1992 to 2006 Evolution versions have lighter rods and use 7 bolts to secure the flywheel to the crankshaft. They are referred to as the "six bolt" and "seven bolt" engines, respectively.

Output for the 2003 Japanese/US Mitsubishi Lancer Evolution is 271 hp (202 kW) at 6500 rpm with 273 ft·lbf (370 N·m) of torque at 3500 rpm. It has a cast iron engine block and aluminum DOHC cylinder head. It uses multi-point fuel injection, has 4 valves per cylinder, is turbocharged and intercooled and features forged steel connecting rods.

In the United Kingdom, a special Lancer Evolution, the FQ-400, produces 302.13 kW (405.2 hp), from a 4G63 engine. At 202.6 hp (151.3 kW) per liter, it has the highest specific output per liter of any production engine.

[af300e]

In the United Kingdom, a special Lancer Evolution, the FQ-400, produces 302.13 kW (405.2 hp), from a 4G63 engine. At 202.6 hp (151.3 kW) per liter, it has the highest specific output per liter of any production engine.


Last rx7 at "206kw" and 1308cc is 157.5kw per litre.
Was likely more than the manufacturer agreed 206 kw too

[kaibeecee]

sigma box would not withstand 200kw for very long

starion box is a bit stronger if i remember

you'd need a custom clutch too.

[Jonny Rochester]

Hey Jonny


I would be very interested if you have any more info regarding this as i am looking at bringing in 4G63 engines and am thinking about wether or not to fit one into my 86.

cheers

From memory... poor info:

There is a large range of 4G motors, many in vans (even new ones I think, they still make the old Express), old Magnas, Galants, Sigma?, Starion, Lancer EVO, various utes, and Hyundia Lantra. And in America, lots of random FWD things like Eagles and the like. Often called "DSMs" in America for some unknown reason. All can bolt to a RWD gearbox I think, Americans talk of using a (mini)truck gearbox?

Starion is SOHC, EVO is DOHC, but same block as far as I know. Hyundia Lantra is DOHC same as Galant and EVO.

Basically, it is those 3 things I already said.
Bolt spacing between 2 lower main gearbox bolts.
Big or small flywheel.
6 or 7 bolt flywheel.

I only know a bit about vans.

Evo 1 motor is the same as old Galant VR4, except VR4 has 6 bolt crank.
All EVOs have 7 bolt crank I think.
EVO 1,2,3 have the narrow bolt spacing and small flywheel and 7 bolts.

2.4L EFI van has:
wide bolt spacing, large flywheel, hydraulic clutch.

2.0L 90s van has:
narrow bolt spacing, small flywheel, cable clutch, 7 bolts.

diesel van has:
wide bolt spacing. Gearbox fits petral 4G motors.


EVO motor in RWD, you have to cut and shut the intake manifold. Plus deal with the thermostat and water fittings on the back of the head. Use engine mounts from a van or RWD car. Gearbox from Starion or pickup I guess. Van box has side shifter. Plus the van gearbox is too small anyway.

[provar]

hey guys, I'm provan's brother, I'll be doing this conversion with him.

from what i "know" so far we can use engine mounts from a triton ute and rubbers from an escort or something (got it written down somewhere)

sigma gearbox looks like the go as its cable clutch and we can avoid changing pedal boxes that way.

a 4G93 into a KE55 needs the CAS sensor relocated and the thermostat moved (i think).

*****can anyone tell me if there is more space in a KE70 engine bay between the firewall and the block than in a KE55?*****

its going to be a track car, so if I can get away with it, it would be easier to dent the firewall slightly and not cut/shut the manifold, move the CAS and move the thermostat.

EDIT: We also plan to run two wiring looms, keep most of the KE one to make the fans and lights work, and the 4G63 loom to run the motor. obviously some splicing will be needed. is this a good way to go? do i have any other options? will be running the galant gauge cluster too.

[Hokey]

nice ^^^

anyone know of any oiling issues like a 3s when you put a 4g into rwd? i'd love one in my ke. give a nice big fk you to all the sr ke70's out there :D

[provar]

no idea bout oiling issues, I've been researching rwd conversions and so far havn't heard of any problems. you thinking it might have some issues because of the angle of the block possibly being different? 4G63's are pretty tough motors tho I doubt anything could kill one!

EDIT: hey Hokey, your CA18DET conversion thread, the Crank Angle Sensor (CAS) is on the front of the head, is that factory location? any idea if i could get it to work on the front of a 4G63? our biggest issue atm is space near the back of the block, and moving that is one problem solved

[Jonny Rochester]

No oiling issues. Look at the EVO or Galant or whatever, the engine is near dead straight up and down.

You may choose to swap to a RWD waterpump setup, as the FWD setup has both rad hoses going to the back of the motor. You have to have a look at this, decide what is easiest.

If you are using a FWD motor, you WILL have to cut and shut the intake manifold. Not hard with a aluminium welder, even if you have to pay someone. Throttle body will want to be at the front. Custom throttle cable (factor the cost of that).

CAS can probably stay where it is, it's fairly low profile. Dent the firewall if needed.

If you use a turbo motor, like from a EVO I, II, III, you need to bolt the turbo on 180 degrees. So the intake of the turbo is at the front, and exhaust side at the rear. It fits, but the dump pipe may end up being a funny angle. Will need to rotate the turbo housings a little, and modify oil supply and drain to the turbo.

[provar]

think the water pump isn't a huge issue, just cut the pipe that runs the length of the block short and run a U bend rad hose. then i might even be able to use that piece of pipe for a section of the top (return?) radiator line.

thinking I may have trouble with the thermostat housing. hoping i can just cut off the outlet and re-join that so it points parallel to the fire wall not towards the drivers seat.

any idea on how much room there's going to be between the throttle body outlet and the firewall before I cut it? would love to avoid cutting this even if we have to be very tight and dodgy.

[Jonny Rochester]

I don't think you understand. The whole throttle body has to be chopped off, then welded onto the front of the manifold.

[provar]

yeah I understand, just worded my sentence wrong. if the engine is put in with the manifold untouched. how much space is there from the outlet of the throttle body to the firewall? If there is atleast 3inches or close to that I can get away without cutting it.
Have you done this conversion before? you seem pretty knowledgeable.

[Jonny Rochester]

The throttle near the firewall will be fairly ghetto, but if it works...

I havn't done it in a KE70, no. And I have only played with the 4G63 turbo motors, and have had a good look at the 2.4L 4G## van motor.

I had a oiling issue with a EVO 7 once. Completely stock EVO 7 car, oil all over the bonnet and up the windscrean, and oil covered one side of the car. Plus a burning smell. Also parts of pistons sitting on the stone tray, and half a conrod loose in the engine bay. All fixed now.

[provar]

yeah ive found a silicone bend that goes 90 in its own width so all I need is about 3inches and im set!

[provar]

what options do I have for a rear diff? really dont want to do anything custom, will anything bolt straight in? or will a locked KE70 diff be tough enough?

[yoshimitsu9]

think the water pump isn't a huge issue, just cut the pipe that runs the length of the block short and run a U bend rad hose. then i might even be able to use that piece of pipe for a section of the top (return?) radiator line.

thinking I may have trouble with the thermostat housing. hoping i can just cut off the outlet and re-join that so it points parallel to the fire wall not towards the drivers seat.

any idea on how much room there's going to be between the throttle body outlet and the firewall before I cut it? would love to avoid cutting this even if we have to be very tight and dodgy.

perhaps run a 4ac remote thermostat housing?

[provar]

that would work, then have to put a flange and an outlet onto the block where the old thermostat goes. do I need to change anything to make it open at the correct temp for 4G63's?

[xsoarerx]

cant u bolt the 4g63 upto a sigma gbox?

skiped over a few posts but sure this hasnt been said yet./.. i think?

castlemain or dellow's? make 4g63 to W5X bell housings for conversions... form what ive picked up looking at the sigma forums is that the sigma gear box is not overly weak but they prefer to use the starion gearbox then the supra gearbox is the next one up from that where a few starion 4g63 users upgrade to from there standard box.

but that being said... apperently sigma bellhousings are fine to bolt up as well as B2200 mazda truck bellhousings too which you can buy brand new from mazda.

i think this is an awesome idea.

pros - strong as an SR if not stronger, prob jsut as much fab work as putting an SR in, very different.

cons - early evo motors would be pretty straped, the dellow/rod shop bellhousings arnt the best desgin wise, less info around.

[provar]

thanks mate! I'm looking into starion boxes, but no one can tell me 100% what model I need one from, may just have to go to a wreckers and measure the bottom and top bolt distances. but worst case, a sigma box will work.

this whole idea sort of fell into our lap, we wanted a drift car and had a 4G63 in the shed, being complete tight asses we put 2 and 2 together... or more 70 and 63 together :D

the way this is looking there won't be a whole lot of fab work either, atm....
definitly tail shaft and clutch, exhaust.
possibly inlet manifold, thermostat housing (maybe 4ac), throttle cable.

everything else like engine mounts I think we can steal from other cars

[xsoarerx]

i say do a good search thru www.sigma-galant.com and www.austarion.com (i think thats there addresses) and theres a few others... there is info about but you have to sift thru it.

[provar]

cheers mate, already been through austarion stuff, most of the guys seem to be putting 4G63 heads on starion bottom ends. so none of the threads say anything about gearboxes bolting up to 4g63's. but i'll sus out the other one and subscribe and ask if i have to, thanks again

[xsoarerx]

humm... just have a good search on sigma galant... they have an old forum archived as well so search thru that... there is about 4 or 5 threads about gearbox's... use search

easy.

[wntdae86]

maybe try a dodge site as i know the neon is sum what a 4g63 4 the srt4 there mayb a gearbox you can use out of a dodge sumwhere !!!!

[provar]

maybe try a dodge site as i know the neon is sum what a 4g63 4 the srt4 there mayb a gearbox you can use out of a dodge sumwhere !!!!

americans...gulp...last resort lol but cheers i'll sus that out too!

[provan]

hey
as for the radiator hose ive seen a 4g63 into an old Chrysler galant where they used a 90 degree pipe on the motor on both top and bottom then theyve cut a piece of stainless pipe to go from the pipe to the radiator then just used a connector to connect it to the radiator

[spoon]

From what i've read, any gearbox that was behind a 4g5* will fit, as long as its not an auto as they have a wide block and 4g6* boxs fit, i think theres others too from 4g3* or something i think. 4g6* are in L200 utes, L300 vans, Starions, Cordias, Galants, EVOs, and more, 4g5* are in sigmas and others...
The sigma boxs are borgwarner(aussie) and starion is Jap box, hence the strength difference (if any).
Im planning on doing the same thing except with a 4g62 (cordia) engine cos i have a cordia sitting out the back here, and the motor would be much better suited in a KE!

[gaz20v]

have a look through this site, has a bit of alrite info

http://www.projectzerog.com/index.shtml

Unfortunatly it looks as though the mazda b2200/2600 bellhousing/rx7 box combo only applies to wideblock engines , i believe the sohc 4g63 is wideblock, as is the 4g64 (2.4l)

If you have a few extra $$ laying around in the future there is good scope for stroking etc with these engines at a reasonable price, for example using a 4g64 crank in a 4g63 with 63 rods and pistons to suit (pretty much every aftermarket forged piston company now sells them off the shelf with the correct pin offset to suit) will make you a 2.3l stroker.

or alternativly you can destroke a 4g64 block to 2.1l with a 4g63 crank etc, some people like this for some reason, good for revs?? cant remember.

Im jealous, would love to put a 4g63 in my 71!!

[provar]

have a look through this site, has a bit of alrite info

http://www.projectzerog.com/index.shtml

Unfortunatly it looks as though the mazda b2200/2600 bellhousing/rx7 box combo only applies to wideblock engines , i believe the sohc 4g63 is wideblock, as is the 4g64 (2.4l)

If you have a few extra $$ laying around in the future there is good scope for stroking etc with these engines at a reasonable price, for example using a 4g64 crank in a 4g63 with 63 rods and pistons to suit (pretty much every aftermarket forged piston company now sells them off the shelf with the correct pin offset to suit) will make you a 2.3l stroker.

or alternativly you can destroke a 4g64 block to 2.1l with a 4g63 crank etc, some people like this for some reason, good for revs?? cant remember.

Im jealous, would love to put a 4g63 in my 71!!

holy crap!

sir I bow down before you, that site is fucking awesome!!

[provar]

just thought i'd post for others to know, just found out STARION BOXES WILL NOT FIT FWD 4G63'S. they will however fit the wide block 4G6x's from rwd cars

only thing that will fit a 4G63 narrow block is a D50 gearbox from Dodge Ram D50, Mitsubishi Mighty Max and Plymouth Arrow, as long as they have 12.25" between the bottom belhousing bolts.

[gaz20v]

hahah glad it was of help, have researched a bit on these engines having had a galant vr4 a few years back, love them!!! plus my first car was an 82 mazda 929 with an astron 2.6 in it (previous owner converted it), i swapped the astron with a starion version sohc turbo g63... i dont recommend this tho, was super slow and expensive...

good luck with it all mate, make sure you put up pics etc along the way cos this conversion into corollas is very rarely documented even though there is quite a few out there.

[Jonny Rochester]

Look into Dodge Ram D50 or whatever. You may find in translates exactly to a Mitsubishi Triton ute or something.

[shift_rook]

wow, at first it seemed silly, but yeah this'd actualy be awesome! would be slightly cooler if turbo but ah well, n/a will still be excellent!

[gaz20v]

Look into Dodge Ram D50 or whatever. You may find in translates exactly to a Mitsubishi Triton ute or something.

yeah americans call tritons "mighty max's" i think, very similar asthetically.

[provar]

I need to know if the distance from the firewall to the engine mounts is the same in a KE70 as it is in an AE86?

i need to know this as space is going to be very limited near the head and I know the motor will JUST fit into an 86.

[provar]

bump for help????