Lock Spacers - run 2?

[Beau]

Hey guys i was just curious if anyone runs two AJPS type lock spacers? Or is it possible?

Does it give even more lock? Or is it just a waste of time and money and 1 is fine on its own?

Thanks

[Simon-KE70]

doesnt work that way, the rack can only travel so far before it runs out of teeth, the lock spacer allows the rack to travel slightly further to use all the available teeth.

if you require even more lock then rack spacers and PS arms then theres only a couple of options left, and that is modified steering arms (IE, sell the PS arms and cut and shut some stock 86 arms shorter then PS arms) and playing with longer LCA's etc

[Beau]

doesnt work that way, the rack can only travel so far before it runs out of teeth, the lock spacer allows the rack to travel slightly further to use all the available teeth.

if you require even more lock then rack spacers and PS arms then theres only a couple of options left, and that is modified steering arms (IE, sell the PS arms and cut and shut some stock 86 arms shorter then PS arms) and playing with longer LCA's etc

Thanks Simon. I had heard mixed rumours so i just wanted set it straight in my mind. i dont really need anymore. But then again i wouldnt say no to more.

Thanks for the extra tips!

[Simon-KE70]

no mate, i hear it all the time, some people assume they are magical things that keep adding more lock the more you put on :P

on nissans, if you run too many you run into binding issues which is a result of the tie rod hyper extending.... when this happens... you cant bring the steering back from full lock at all, not a nice feeling!

[biggo]

I cut more teeth into the rack. The plan is to run 2 lock spacers but i highy dont reccommend it as it renders the rack pretty useless. Plus its not very safe.

One problem i have with mine is the calipers are hitting the castor arms. Still yet to figure out a way around it.

[R&D Mechanical]

long control arm? ^^

[biggo]

i was thinking that but meh.

might just try out some nrca's first

[Simon-KE70]

bit of a bandaid solution that one.

longer LCA is the way to go

[Beau]

Thanks guys! if i need more i'll look into more options. But i think my current set up is great and if anything id rather have more response then lock.

[evil86]

you probably can try put a washer/spacer after AJPS lock spacer

[Beau]

you probably can try put a washer/spacer after AJPS lock spacer

nah thats dangerous, by that you are decreasing the amount of thread holding your left wheel to the rack. Im scared enough of my tie rods snapping (hence why i have overpriced nasiga ones) let alone spacing my lock by 2mm

[Sam-Q]

two lock spacers shouldnt be used as it reduces the thread being used to hold the steering ball joints in place by heaps. Now on an ae86 I have to disgree with everyone and I found that my steering rack had heaps of travel left in it for atleast 3 standard lock spacers after I installed mine. I say just get the bolt on type of lock spacers from AJPS and you will be set.

[Rian]

thread hijaking..

buttt has anyone had any hassles instaling there lockspacers..

it screws in and out fine... and ive tried it on 2 racks

on the my 86 rack wen its fully screwed in it seems off centre and wont slide into the seal. but out a quater turn its centred and works...

on the ke70 rack.. which has less wear then the 86.. it doesnt seem centred at all?

it just seems machined wrong.....anyone no what im talking about..?

[Simon-KE70]

yeah ive seen it before myself... where did u get them from?

i believe AJPS had a bad batch ages ago... but has since been solved?

[Konakid]

If PS arms and a lock spacer isnt enough lock for you then you suck at drifting.

[Simon-KE70]

not entirely true mate.... what do you do once you've reached the limits of PS arms... u want more :P

[Rian]

i got it from ajps like 2 days ago..

maybe hes sent me an old one out... its just like the thread is off centre.

[Beau]

If PS arms and a lock spacer isnt enough lock for you then you suck at drifting.

You hurt me. Come on you gotta get on that stupid angle of no return to scare the nissans!

[Konakid]

haha just messing, what setup have you got now?

PS arms is a fair whack of lock, combined with a rack spacer i cant see how you couldn't enter backwards if need be!

[Dave]

It is possible to run 2 lock spacers in your rack. Not entirely sure if its safe or not but it seems to work fine. Run one screw on lockspacer on the passenger side, then run a slip on spacer/washer on the other side. Plenty of lock, then again ps arms would be the way to go.

[Beau]

haha just messing, what setup have you got now?

PS arms is a fair whack of lock, combined with a rack spacer i cant see how you couldn't enter backwards if need be!

haha i knows.

just a new rack, screw in spacer, xt130 arms, nasiga tie rods, pwr steer arms and cusco castor rods with a bit of castor of extra castor

its great amount of lock. The best is hearing the nissan boys complaining about doing tandem with me as i can enter on such a angle that it is either spin or superhappyskidofpower and they all back off thinking im going to spin.. ahhh:piggy:

[kaibeecee]

haha just messing, what setup have you got now?

PS arms is a fair whack of lock, combined with a rack spacer i cant see how you couldn't enter backwards if need be!

my usable lock is about the same as the PS arms/lock spacer setup, and i've wound it out a few times sliding and still want more, and more!

[ToySprinta]

Are the NCRCA's ok in place of longer lower control arms?

Going into technical detail, what has better scrub radius, NCRCA or longer control arms...?

[sonsta]

ncrca's are fine to use, i used them for ages with no trouble, and if im not mistaken i think thats what the kaizen garage boys were using wasnt it?

[Beau]

i cant give the tech on NCRAS but i know they add more diagonal force on your ball joints with the usual outcome of destroying ball joints rapid fire!

[Sam-Q]

your scrub angle gets even worse too, I am looking into seeing if I can fit a positive roll center adjuster

[ToySprinta]

So longer LCA's with standard RCA's would be a better setup?
I've been running NCRCA's for 2 years now, haven't screwed the balljoints yet...


your scrub angle gets even worse too, I am looking into seeing if I can fit a positive roll center adjuster

as in the bottom of the strut sitting inboard of the Balljoint? Could you just spin a set of NCRCA's around to get this?

[Beau]

So longer LCA's with standard RCA's would be a better setup?
I've been running NCRCA's for 2 years now, haven't screwed the balljoints yet...


I probably should have added this is not personal experience and is just what i have read.

[Beau]

Proof that it works....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ljbSC2XRcGM

[Jonny Rochester]

Great video. I think that witches hat got scared for a few seconds.

On the topic of extra lock, I had recently made a few sets of rack ends with a step for extra lock. Still waiting for feedback. It's another device you can add that does not change the length or geometry of any other part. About 5 or 6mm either side.

[The Kid]

Ive been sitting here trying to get my head around this...
If you put a lock spacer on one side, your going to be making use of the teeth on that end of the rack that are usually never used due to the rack end hitting the housing. But this is just on one side, so to make use of the extra teeth on the other side would you not need another rack spacer on that end??
Now my logic could be very easily flawed, this is as far as I can get before my mind starts imploding with thoughts of the effect of lengthening racks etc etc, feel very free to correct me.

[Jonny Rochester]

You realy need to have a rack apart on the bench to see. There are more teeth available to the left side.

To allow the pinion to be installed after the rack is already in the housing, there is a cutout in the rack where there is no teeth at all. To make sure you never get to this point in normal operation, there is a fair few teeth extra.

[Konakid]

Great video. I think that witches hat got scared for a few seconds.

On the topic of extra lock, I had recently made a few sets of rack ends with a step for extra lock. Still waiting for feedback. It's another device you can add that does not change the length or geometry of any other part. About 5 or 6mm either side.

Sounds good, pics?

[Robo86]

i should have lock pictures tonight jonny :)

[johl]

Ive been sitting here trying to get my head around this...
If you put a lock spacer on one side, your going to be making use of the teeth on that end of the rack that are usually never used due to the rack end hitting the housing. But this is just on one side, so to make use of the extra teeth on the other side would you not need another rack spacer on that end??
Now my logic could be very easily flawed, this is as far as I can get before my mind starts imploding with thoughts of the effect of lengthening racks etc etc, feel very free to correct me.

you re-centre the rack so you arnt just adding more lock to one side

[Rian]

nahhhhhp
i filed the c**t down and its in the car now. it works good enough.. but if it stuffs up i;ll hit u up.

[Oversized 86]

was doing a little bit of investigationing this arvo with a sprinter rack...

im going to run an AJPS bolt on lock spacer on the passenger side and then grab one of the rackends from j. roch...

my investigationing has lead me to discover that you have around 5mm or so, maybe a touch more, that you can run inside the rack on the drivers side...

so if my investigationing is correct, i will be a happy chap...

what do you think j. roch?

[Jonny Rochester]

I would normaly expect my rack ends to be used as a pair. Extra 5 or 6mm either side, so 10-12mm total extra movement. And they can be used with the AJPS spacer also (if tyres don't touch something). But there are lots of combinations possible, so it is ultimately up to you to make sure your setup is safe.

Mostly, I think the AJPS spacer would be wanted with a KE70 rack, as it is not as long standard.

[Robo86]

^^just following up on this. not the 2 lock spacer thing. just lock in general.
p.s arms + johnnys spoken off rack ends.
http://www.ae86drivingclub.com.au/dcimages/6/9/12386.jpg

[ae86]

doesnt the inside scrub atall with that much lock ?

[Robo86]

nut and thats with a rubbish ma61 rim

xt130 lca

[sundee]

can someone tell me the length of stock steering arms Vs Power steer arms?
im guessing their measured hole center to center?

the lock on that last pic is insane!

[Jonny Rochester]

Yep. Even I was imporessed by that pic. Still 1 or 2 days before I sort out my own steering.

The regular steerings arms are about 126mm from hole to hole, and the PS arms are about 113-115mm. The pivot point to pivot point length is a little different to that due to all the weird angles, and it's harder to measure.

[stylz]

soo... 2 lock spacers + power steering arms = win? ^_^

[Rice86]

extra extra lock only looks good when u park...so why not =b

[ae86hachiroku]

Shortened (HEYMAN) knuckles, Tec-arts LCA, Cusco castor rods, rose-joint tie rod ends, no lock spacer or teeth cut. NRCA. Will extend the LCA soon and move it back to a normal RCA though, but for the time being it works fine.

Example : http://www.ae86drivingclub.com.au/dcimages/1/4/10220.jpg

[sundee]

if u didnt spin in that pic u r god!

[FAST EDDIE]

ke70 arms are shorter thatn ae86 std ones?? well they look that way, i could measure them but im lazy haha

[sundee]

Yep. Even I was imporessed by that pic. Still 1 or 2 days before I sort out my own steering.

The regular steerings arms are about 126mm from hole to hole, and the PS arms are about 113-115mm. The pivot point to pivot point length is a little different to that due to all the weird angles, and it's harder to measure.

Dam i just measured mine and their 133mm hole center to center!.. :worried: