ECU Trigger on a 5K
Hi guys,
It's probably not the most common thing done out there but I hope someone might be
able to help me out here.
I'll get started with this question, How do I set up the trigger system on a 5k?
AAAANNNND...... How can I do this without blowing the bank?
Thirdly before anyone says talk to Haltech support I already have and they have been less than helpfull
by throwing me generic responses and shoving god damn reluctor adaptor pinouts in my face which I didn't ask for in the first place.
The long story.
I am on the path of going EFI on my 5k and have come to a roadblock.
I thought I had everything sorted and knew everything I needed to know.
Until I got to the last part, the Trigger!!! For those of you who do not know
what I am talking about you might as well not read mutch further unless you have the same issue (which I doubt).
So... Where the hell do I start? I need a dam trigger system and have been pointed in many directions but see possible flaws in each.
Firstly some info on my setup.
Haltech E6 Fuel and ignition control (only one ignition output so a distributorless is out of the question at this stage)
For those who don't know this, the older model Haltechs sutch as mine require a square wave input sutch as a Hall effect signal.
I can use a reluctor signal but requre a RA10 reluctor adaptor, which brings on one option of a trigger.
I have the Electronic distributor which has an internal reluctor pickup. At first I thought cool this is going to be easy!
But then I thought that the distributor would actually ignite as soon as it can see the reluctor signal. This can not work
on an ECU setup becasue the ECU needs to see that signal about 70 Deg BTC sooo is that an option that I should forget about or is there
more to it than I am thinking? I can't rotate the shaft back can I? I was thinking of setting up the Dizzy 70 deg out and then letting the ECU fire the ignitor.
So on to the simplest but most expensive setup. It's what they call a flying magnet setup. Basically I need to make two aluminium discs
that bolts up to the crank and camshaft pulleys and mount rare earth magnets at 180 degrees apart set at 70 Deg BTC as they pass the pickup. The problem is that
each Hall effect sensor costs $160 and I need two, one for trigger and one for home. I was wondering If any common EFI cars came out with Hall Effect sensors
that I would be able to raid at my local wreckers. Most that I have seen have been reluctor type.
So what would you guys do in this situation? I have the manual and it does not say anything about this except for a diagram on how to mount the flying magnet setup.
The book does not even mention what the Home signal needs to be, would it be TDC on Cyl No:1??
I have talked to the Haltech technical support that is supposedly a great team, this is what they E-mailed me:
This is the same response evey time I send them a question, maybe they have me on a do not deal with customer list?
If I had the money I would have just simply bought a new model ECU but I had this laying in my shed for the past couple of years
and only cost me $350 so I might as well use it.
Sooooo any thoughts?
Cheers
Cheers Nick,
I did initially think of MS but since I already have the haltech I didn't want something different.
I have also done 90% of the Haltech wiring loom and almost all of the sensors bought so I'd like to stick with the E6
I have just received a great pointer into a cheaper and more useable sensor. It's a hall effect
sensor but the magnet is actually in built with the sensor, so instead of a flying magnet setup
I can just use a ferrous disc with two teeth as the trigger and then a similar setup on the camshaft.
Here are the details:
Sensor Part No: Honeywell 1gt101dc
(technical details)
RS does them for $57.50, can't complain on that price! Alot better than $160 in any case!
Interesting. Nice work.
Hope that works out for you. Would be a pain in the arse to have to rewire everything.
What exactly are you going to do with the 5K?
Cheers
Nick
Well I have been in a constant mind changing state with what I wanted from the engine ranging from Quad Mikuni R1 carbs which I half made a manifold for. Then I went to
Draw through AMR500 supercharger which I made all the plumbing and mounts up and then decided to go Blow through, which again I changed the plumbing, made a pressure vessel
and then re-built a 32/36 webber. Then a couple of weeks ago I think I finally made a final decision.
A member on Rollaclub was advertising a 4K-EFI manifold with Supra 7MGE Yellow injectors, I couldn't refuse. He was a local here in Adelaide to top it off. So almost the next day
I went to his house and bought it. I already had the Haltech that was sitting in the shed for a couple of years so i thought why not?
A week later I had most of the wiring loom made up and bought most of the sensors (should I say pillaged from u-pull it).
So far my plans for the 5k is to get the engine running with the Haltech in an NA setup to make sure I have everything wired up right and that everything works.
From there I will add the AMR500 supercharger and run it at a weak 5psi and then bump it up to 10 psi when I have everything nutted out.
I'm not looking for monster power but at least something to keep up with traffic and then focus on a track only car later on.
Some piccies for anyone interested:
Modified TPS from 3 way to POT type
Sweet 4K injection manifold
My haul from the wreckers
My headache
The Beast
The other beast that plays in mud
Just so you can see what I am working with here is the software to run the E6.
Tip: This software was designed for windows 3.1 so the title screen appears a bit fudged.
Press "N" when it loads up, from there it's just pushing the corresponding buttons to traverse
through the menus. The one you want to look at is the Engine Identification menu by pressing "I"
You will see that there isn't alot of options there to mess around with for the ignition.
I even have the period correct Windows 3.1 laptop!
Just out of curiousity, why did you go for the 4KE EFI setup? They are never going to make decent numbers on the dyno...
I've owned one myself and LOL'd when it arrived and I realised that you could choke the thing with a 50 cent coin
Bonus points for sourcing a win3.1 laptop.
Yes the throttle body definately could do with improvements. I didn't so mutch go for the 4k efi specifically it was more of an impulse buy.
K series EFI manifolds arent all that common so when one poped up for a measly sum of $250 with supra injectors already fitted I bought it.
I would have preffered the 7K manifold but it seemed as though that no one had them locally. Trademe NZ has some stuff every now and then
but usually it is sold with the engine. Paying over $800 for a 7k is a bit rich I think.
Or maybe I just havent searched for long enough....
Either way I will find out soon enough if it makes enough power.
I think the issue is that the 7K manifold falls under the "commercial vehicles" category and as such you need to talk to a commercial wrecker to get one off a townace, $800 for the manifold seems a bit steep.
lol @ supra injectors in a 4KE manifold. They are never going to get enough airflow. I wonder what the previous owner was thinking? Stock is Greentops from memory and about 140cc - LOL... Price sounds about right, I think I paid about $200 all inclusive for my 4KE. it came with the rocker cover (extended oil filler), manifold, injectors, some wiring and the ECU. its a bit of a joke. So much effing around to make it all work though, plus the $$$ I gave it all away and purchased a newer EFI car instead.
P.s. glad to hear you ditched the draw-through idea. I honestly don't think you're going to make the supercharger work off the 4KE manifold. It is just too big a restriction. Its going to try to stuff some air in there, but its going to be a bit like pissing in the wind IMO. If I were you I would probably just work on tuning it N/A and enjoy the 4K EFI reliability. So much better than a stupid aisan or weber carby.
Still, would like to hear how this all goes...
I might check the commercial wreckers then! But in the interum I'll do the best with what I've got.
It might just be okay with only a 5psi setup but I guess I'll see it when it happens.
Once I get this thing up and running I'll make a thread for it just to show how it goes, hopefully it does ok.
With the injectors they are 295cc/min tested at 255kPa. Maybe running them at a lower duty cycle will work but I am unsure at this stage.
This is my first EFI build so everything is new to me.
Thanks for the help!
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